with and by

Question

Hi,Please tell me the difference in meaning between:1. Pension fund members and endowment holders do not have the right to vote at annual meetings but they can raise concerns about companies held on their behalf with trustees and fund managers.2. Pension fund members and endowment holders do not have the right to vote at annual meetings but they can raise concerns about companies held on their behalf by trustees and fund managers.ThanksQuoc

Diamondrg · Accepted Answer

'by' is correct. This is a passive structure so the agent has to be expressed using 'by', not 'with'. ...... concerns about companies (which are) held on their behalf by trustees .......

- Trustees hold companies on their behalf.

- Companies are held on their behalf by trustees.

Ruslana · Answer

Hi, Tung Quoc,

When you have some doubt whether to use "with" or "by", remember that by is used in passive voice to mark an acting person or a power, whereas with is used in both active and passive voices to mark a thing by means of which an action is accomplished.

The fire was put out by the fireman. (passive voice, by marks the acting person)

This machine is driven by electricity. (passive voice, by marks the acting power)

The fire was put out with water. (passive vioce, with marks the thing by means of which the fire was put out)

They put out the fire with water. (active voice, the same)

Tung Quoc · Answer

Hi Diamondrg,

You said (2) is correct . That means (1) is incorrect. So, why did the author write (1)?

If both are correct, what is the difference in meaning between them?

Quoc

PS: Here is the link: http://business.guardian.co.uk/story/0,,1934076,00.html

Marius Hancu · Answer

The meanings are different:

1. raise concerns with someone (trustees and ...)
They discuss the situation with someone (trustees).

2. held/owned by someone (trustees and ...)
The companies are held/owned by someone (trustees), on their behalf.

Diamondrg · Answer

Tung Quoc
Hi Diamondrg,

You said (2) is correct . That means (1) is incorrect. So, why did the author write (1)?

If both are correct, what is the difference in meaning between them?

Quoc

PS: Here is the link: http://business.guardian.co.uk/story/0,,1934076,00.html

Hi Quoc,

Sorry for the confusion. I've learnt that "raise concerns" collacates with "with". Now both "by" and "with" would be correct but with different meanings.

1- Pension fund members and endowment holders do not have the right to vote at annual meetings but they can raise concerns about companies held on their behalf with trustees and fund managers.

This can be rewritten as "... they can raise concens with trustees and fund managers about companies held on their behalf." This responds to the question:

- Who can they raise concerns with? Trustees and fund managers.

2- Pension fund members and endowment holders do not have the right to vote at annual meetings but they can raise concerns about companies held on their behalf by trustees and fund managers.

This answers to

- What can they raise concerns about? Companies held by trustees and fund managers on their behalf.

with and by

Top answer

Get the Weekly English Kit 📬

Related Questions