using the possessive case: which versions are okay?

Question

Hi,Could somebody please comment on the following sample sentences? Which are NOT correct grammar and why?(1) She always wore a boy's clothes when she was a schoolgirl(2) She always wore boy's clothes when ...(3) She always wore boys' clothes when ...thank you in advance!mus-te

CalifJim · Accepted Answer

MUSCOVITE-
(1) She always wore a boy's clothes when ...
(2) She always wore boy's clothes when ...
(3) She always wore boys' clothes when ...

(2) is wrong because boy's is a singular countable noun, and it has no article. Singular countable nouns have to have an article.

The other two are correct. Note that boys clothes is also accepted informally as a compound noun, especially in the clothing industry.

CJ

MUSCOVITE · Answer

Thank you, CalifJim!

CalifJim(2) is wrong because boy's is a singular countable noun, and it has no article.

This obviously means that the indefinite atricle is "connected" with the immediately following noun ('boy', not 'clothes')

Now, let's take a look at another example sentence (I hope it is correct English)

She wore a children's gown of the imperial academy

In this example, the indefinite article seems to be 'connected' with the 'gown', not the 'children'?

So we seem to have a pair of correct English sentences:

(A) She always wore a boy's clothes...
(B) She wore a children's gown....

and I still cannot figure out what specific grammar rule stands behind these and similar grammar structures.

CalifJim · Answer

MUSCOVITEThis obviously means that the indefinite atricle is "connected" with the immediately following noun ('boy', not 'clothes')

Yes. You can't have "a clothes", so the "a" has to go with "boy".

MUSCOVITEShe wore a children's gown of the imperial academyIn this example, the indefinite article seems to be 'connected' with the 'gown', not the 'children'?

Oof! That's strange to my ear. She wore a child's gown would be my choice.

It's a woman's opinion, not a women's opinion.

MUSCOVITESo we seem to have a pair of correct English sentences

Not really, but I understand where you're going with this. I wish I could think of a better pair of sentences to illustrate your point, but the example you're looking for occurs so rarely that I can't think of anything at the moment. (But see the examples below.)

MUSCOVITEI still cannot figure out what specific grammar rule stands behind these and similar grammar structures.

I believe this is the information you're looking for.

The PossP determiner marks the superordinate NP as definite, even if the subordinate one is indefinite: a reviewer's responsibility, for example, means "the" (not "a") "responsibility of a reviewer". (Rodney Huddleston, Introduction to the Grammar of English, Cambridge University Press, 1984)

In other words, when a possessive precedes a noun, the noun cannot be taken as indefinite. That also applies to words like my and his, which is why we have separate constructions for those cases where the superordinate is to be interpreted as indefinite.

my friend (= *the friend of me) / a friend of mine; one of my friends (= *a friend of me)

In the cases that contradict that principle (a men's room = a restroom for men), the two nouns almost coalesce semantically into a single lexical item (a *mensroom). Similarly, a children's playground = a playground for children.

CJ

MUSCOVITE · Answer

CalifJimI believe this is the information you're looking for.The PossP determiner marks the superordinate NP as definite, even if the subordinate one is indefinite: a reviewer's responsibility, for example, means "the" (not "a") "responsibility of a reviewer". (Rodney Huddleston, Introduction to the Grammar of English, Cambridge University Press, 1984)In other words, when a possessive precedes a noun, the noun cannot be taken as indefinite. That also applies to words like my and his, which is why we have separate constructions for those cases where the superordinate is to be interpreted as indefinite.my friend (= *the friend of me) / a friend of mine; one of my friends (= *a friend of me)In the cases that contradict that principle (a men's room = a restroom for men), the two nouns almost coalesce semantically into a single lexical item (a *mensroom). Similarly, a children's playground = a playground for children.

Yes! That's exactly what I've been after. Many many thanks for your help with this issue.

using the possessive case: which versions are okay?

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