the end of the world around the corner

Question

0Do you get the feeling that the end of the world is just around the corner? Look at the major disasters around the world this year alone, the devastating cyclone in Myanmar, the deadly earthquake in China, heavy storms ripping across the US, wars and conflicts around the globe, food crisis in Africa, etc, Some of these have never happened in the areas before. Take the SziChuan earthquake for an example. Never in the history of the peaceful province had a quake of that magnitude occurred before. 02br02br00Are there any mistakes?02br02br00Thanks.0-

CalifJim · Accepted Answer

0Do you get the feeling that the end of the world is just around the corner? Look at the major disasters around the world this year alone, the devastating cyclone in Myanmar, the deadly earthquake in China, heavy storms ripping across the US, wars and conflicts around the globe, 01font00the02font00 food crisis in Africa01font01b00.02b02font00 01del~~00etc,02del~~00 Some of these have never happened 01font01del~~00in the areas02del~~00 in those areas02font00 before. Take the SziChuan earthquake01font01b00,02b02font00 for 01font01del~~00an02del~~02font00 example. Never 01font00before02font00 in the history of 01font01del~~00the 01font00peaceful02font02del~~00 that 01font00quiet02font02font00 province had a quake of that magnitude occurred01font01del~~00 before02del~~02font00. 02br
01i00peaceful02i00 seems to indicate 'not warlike', which is not relevant to a natural disaster.02br
01i00quiet02i00 might better express seismic inactivity, which is probably more to the point.02br
00I didn't like two sentences ending with before, so I changed one. (happened ... before / occurred before)02br
00You might put a colon instead of a comma after 01i00this year alone02i00. 02br
00CJ 0-

New2grammar · Answer

0Thanks, CJ for the corrections. I have been putting off this question for quite some time, thinking that I wasn't an important issue. I think, now is a good time to address this issue of 'the vs that/those'02br
02br
00Take "in the areas" for example. Since the areas/countries are listed before the phrase is used, I can't understand why those is preferred. Similarly, the SziChuan province has been mentioned several times in the piece, why THAT quiet province?0-

Marius Hancu · Answer

0you've mentioned them: that/those02br
00you'll mention them (starting right now): this/these 0-

New2grammar · Answer

0Thank you, MH. Though I agree with your reply, that's not my question.02br
02br
00you've mentioned them: that/those (My question is why that/those instead of THE which grammar tells us to use)02br
02br
00you'll mention them (starting right now): this/these 0-

CalifJim · Answer

0 01blockquote

01cite10New2grammar12cite10Take "in the areas" for example. Since the areas/countries are listed before the phrase is used, I can't understand why those is preferred. Similarly, the SziChuan province has been mentioned several times in the piece, why THAT quiet province?12blockquote

10I hate it when someone asks a question I don't have a good answer to!!! 05000 Well, on second thought, maybe I do have a good answer. I'll let you decide.02br
02br
00As MH said, 01i00that 02i00and01i00 those02i00 have to do with the idea of "aforementioned". Yet, 01i00the02i00 itself also contains that concept. Still, 01i00that 02i00and 01i00those02i00 emphasize it.02br
01i00___________02i02br
02br
00I believe the preference has to do with 01u00changing the specific word02u00 to a more general 01u00category word02u00 that refers to the entities in question. (01i00areas02i00 in this case.)02br
02br
00After saying, for example:02br
01i00I looked in 01u00books02u00, 01u00magazines02u00, and 01u00letters02u00 to find the answer.02i02br
00if you then said:02br
01i00In the 01u00documents02u00, I found ...02i02br
00it would not be clear that 01i00documents02i00 referred to the same entities that 01i00books, magazines, 02i00and01i00 letters02i00 referred to. Maybe there were other documents, and these were different from the books, magazines, and letters.02br
02br
00So the better choice is:02br
01i00In 01b00those02b00 documents, I found ... 02i02br
00Similarly,02br
01i00The police checked warehouses, factories, churches, and homes. They did not find anything suspicious in 01del~~00the02del~~00 those buildings.02i02br
01i00The carpenter brought a hammer, a saw, and a plane, but 01del~~00the02del~~00 those tools were of no use to him on this particular job. 02i02br
01i00On the table were various kinds of chicken, pork, and beef for us to choose from. However, I found that none of 01del~~00the02del~~00 those dishes were very fresh tasting.02i02br
00___ 02br
00In the cases above, 01i00buildings, tools, 02i00and01i00 dishes02i00 are all words that talk about the previously mentioned things from the viewpoint of a more general category.02br
01i00_____________02i02br
00The 01i00quiet province02i00 case is just a little different, I think. You could almost get away with 01i00the02i00. Here it is probably the addition of the descriptor 01i00quiet02i00 that leads me to prefer 01i00that02i00. We don't know if there are two provinces under consideration: SziChuan province and the quiet province. The use of 01i00that02i00 assures us that the two descriptions refer to the same entity. There is a broad similarity with the previous cases, however, because there is a change from something very specific -- 01i00SziChuan02i00 -- to something more general -- 01i00province02i00.02br
00Compare again:02br
01i00I would like to live in Chicago. I have always liked 01del~~00the02del~~00 that beautiful city.02i02br
01i00Susan has a garden full of roses because she loves 01del~~00the02del~~00 those sweet scented flowers best.02i02br
01i00Karen's car has had problems ever since she bought it. She is really tired of 01del~~00the02del~~00 that unreliable heap of junk! 02i02br
00___02br
01i00the02i00 is almost possible in this last group, but it is a little less clear, I think, and seems more literary or poetic than desirable in the given context. 02br
00CJ 010id1

New2grammar · Answer

0WOW! Great explanation. I've never understood this topic as clear as this. Of course, it will take a while to get used to.02br
02br
00Thanks, CJ!!0-

New2grammar · Answer

0CJ, Unfortunate, I came across a counterexample02br
02br
00It's very difficult to know how many there are left in the world," Derek said. "Some studies show that in the past 20 years, they're down 90 percent. They reproduce very slowly. I think that unless people just stop eating the (shark fin) soup, I don't think the species has a chance."02br
02br
00While it is illegal to traffic shark fins into the United States, enforcing the law is difficult once 01b00the animal parts02b00 make it into the country.02br
02br
00Why not 'those animal parts'?02br
02br
00Thanks.0-

Marius Hancu · Answer

1b00The animal parts02b00 is a bit less specific than 01b00those animal parts02b00, also a bit more detached/neutral. Matter of choice. 0-

New2grammar · Answer

1blockquote

01cite10Marius Hancu12cite10detached/neutral. Matter of choice12blockquote

10MH, I feel the same way. I believe, it depends on what style you're using. For formal articles like news, 01b00the02b00 would be better. For blog entries or converstation, 01b00that/those02b00 is better. Do you agree with my observation about style?02br
02br
00Thanks.0-

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