Subjunctive?

Question

If Mr. Toyoda gets the Toyota presidency, it would be the first time in over a decade that a member of the company’s founding family was at the helm.Is was a subjunctive?Thanks.

Avangi · Accepted Answer

I may be wrong (again), but I think the subjunctive would only be used in the "if"clause.

If Mr. Toyoda were to get the Toyota presidency, If Mr. Toyoda were elected as Toyota president, ("were" may optionally be replaced with "was")

I don't believe the "would" clause uses the subjunctive. That is, you may not replace "was" with "were."

it would be the first time one was it will be the first time one is

(The present tense will not work for the second clause if you use the subjunctive in the "if" clause. It will only work with "if he is/gets elected" or "if he gets the presidency")

- A.

Liveinjapan · Answer

Oh, you helped me a lot and I don't think you gave me a wrong answer!

I don't know what is called but, BTW, to use 'was' is correct,right?

Avangi · Answer

Liveinjapan to use 'was' is correct,right?

Yes, these days it's considered correct. I believe that when you take that option, you no longer say that you're using the subjunctive.

CalifJim · Answer

LiveinjapanIs was a subjunctive?

No. It's a past tense, used to match the past tense would. (A simple "sequence of tenses" problem.)

But the bigger question is why would and not will?

If he gets the presidency, it will be the first time that a family member is at the helm.

Maybe there is a lot of doubt about whether he will get the presidency? If that were so, the if-clause would be in the past.

Or is it just a way for the speaker to show that he is "in the know" while the reader is not? There is a strange use of would that is like that, but I can't quite describe it -- a subtle way of saying "of course, (you dummy)" -- a way of seeming superior, perhaps?

Sorry for the off-topic remarks! I got carried away with a thought I had!

CJ

Liveinjapan · Answer

Thanks, CJ and Avangi(again).

I understand it's not a subjunctive and usally it should be 'is'.

CalifJim"in the know"

Yes, the writer says this based on the information people with knowledge of the plans said.

Cool Breeze · Answer

Hi LiJ

Even though a verb is in the past tense in English, that doesn't necessarily mean that the action occurred in the past. That's why the term preterit, or preterite, is sometimes used to refer to such verbs.

The modal/defective auxiliaries are: can - could; shall - should; will - would; may - might; must; ought.

In a that clause, use the first one of the pair with a verb in the present tense:

I know that he can do it. He knows that I shall/will learn it. They think that we may be right. He knows that it must be easy.

Use the second form with a verb in the past tense:

I knew that he could do it. He knew that I would learn it. They thought that we might be right. Must has no other form, so it's possible with a past tense also: He knew that it must be easy.

These rules don't always apply. For instance, should is possible with the present tense as well: I know that I should do it tomorrow. Ought is also used in many kinds of sentences: I think we ought to go now.

CB

Liveinjapan · Answer

Thanks, CB
Got it!

Yoong Liat · Answer

LiveinjapanIf Mr. Toyoda gets the Toyota presidency, it would be the first time in over a decade that a member of the company’s founding family was at the helm.

Is it correct to use 'got' instead of 'get'?

Avangi · Answer

Yoong Liat
LiveinjapanIf Mr. Toyoda gets the Toyota presidency, it would be the first time in over a decade that a member of the company’s founding family was at the helm.
Is it correct to use 'got' instead of 'get'?

CalifJim But the bigger question is why would and not will?

If he gets the presidency, it will be the first time that a family member is at the helm.

Maybe there is a lot of doubt about whether he will get the presidency? If that were so, the if-clause would be in the past.

Or is it just a way for the speaker to show that he is "in the know" while the reader is not? There is a strange use of would that is like that, but I can't quite describe it -- a subtle way of saying "of course, (you dummy)" -- a way of seeming superior, perhaps?

Hi, Yoong. As you can see, this is an interesting sentence. CB had some good input too.
I think "got" is fine. It seems to go well with the rest of the sentence. I've been struggling to figure how the subjunctive option fits in the "if" clause, re "gets/got." Maybe after I wake up.

CalifJim · Answer

Yoong LiatIs it correct to use 'got' instead of 'get'?

Sure. It indicates that the writer finds it less likely that Mr. Toyoda might really get the presidency. It's then a remark about something more remotely probable. In my experience, that kind of musing about possibilities is not very common in journalism, but I haven't done any research about it.

CJ

Subjunctive?

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