Subject verb agreement

Question

Hi Everyone,A student has asked me a question to which I answered, but he doesn't agree. So, I'm looking to confirm (or otherwise) the subject in question.Here is the sentence that he asked me about:'None of your friends is on the Internet.'I told him it should be ARE not IS because we are referring to 'friends'.He thinks it should be IS based on the word - none.Any thoughts?Thanks CC.

Xerxes · Accepted Answer

Cup cake'None of your friends is on the Internet.'I told him it should be - are - not is because we are referring to 'friends'.He thinks it should be IS based on the word - none.

Your student is right when he says that "is" applies to "none" and not to "friends". However, both "none is" and "none are" are considered to be correct.

Cup cake · Answer

hanks Xerxes

This is one of those questions that I have a real issue with. It's also one area where 'rules' cloud 'logic'.

If I had to choose between

- none is
- friends are

I choose the second one because it makes sense.

To me - none - isn't the subject. 'Friends' is the subject.

I've asked this question (or similar) before and I think I just have trouble accepting IS as a logical answer.

Tamguatlay · Answer

None of your friends is/are on the Internet.

Either verb can be used. So you and your student are correct.

One of your friends is on the Internet. ('are' cannot be used here because only one friend of yours is on the Internet.)
None of your friends is on the Internet. (I prefer "is' because not even one of your friends is on the Internet.)

Cup cake · Answer

Thanks tamguatlay.

Yes, I fully agree with 'one of your friends...'. That makes sense.

OK, fair point about 'none of your friends...'

Maybe I have an issue with the word - none. It's a bit like certain people who hate the word - got.
I personally don't have an issue with this word, but I know many do. Lol.

Xerxes · Answer

Cup cakeIf I had to choose between- none is- friends are

That's got nothing to do with the original sentence, though.

Cup cakeTo me - none - isn't the subject. 'Friends' is the subject.

Proper grammar supersedes how things may or may not appear to you.

Cup cakeI've asked this question (or similar) before and I think I just have trouble accepting IS as a logical answer.

If you have trouble accepting it, there's not much that I can do! I hate to say this, but it sounds like you just don't want to admit that your student may be right and you wrong. That's not what teaching is all about. You owe it to your student to give him the answer he deserves.

It's like this.
Every one of my friends is smart.
You wouldn't say "are smart". It's the same with "none". Only "none" can be either singular or plural.

Cup cake · Answer

Lol...

I didn't tell my student he was wrong; I would never do that. Even when students are wrong, I've got great tactics in handling it.

I wanted to bring it up in this forum to compare the opinions of others.
It's why I come here, to confirm things (one way or another).

BTW, sometimes grammar rules are superseded by population use; just by sheer numbers.
When too many people say something because it just sounds better, then somehow, the rules get wiped out.

You're absolutely right about - every...is.

Fivejedjon · Answer

XerxesProper grammar supersedes how things may or may not appear to you.

Hmm. 'Proper' grammar can be subjective.

From the mid 1750s on, a number of writers managed to impose their views of what 'correct' English was, often using logic and/or cherry-picked rules of Latin grammar to support their prescriptions. Until that time, the language had evolved fairly naturally, and often illogically, free of any artificially imposed rules.

The idea that 'none' must take a singular verb was one of the prescriptions of such writers. The 90+% of the population who received no formal education at all before the third quarter of the 19th century happily continued to say 'none are'.. Indeed, as this https://books.google.com/ngrams/graph?content=none+are%2Cnone+is&year_start=1550&year_end=2000&corpus=15&smoothing=3&share=&direct_url=t1%3B%2Cnone%20are%3B%2Cc0%3B.t1%3B%2Cnone%20is%3B%2Cc0 shows, even those people who could write still preferred the 'none are' form until the late 19th century.

In the second half of the 20th century, grammarians adopted a descriptive rather than a prescriptive approach and, in the UK at least, self-appointed style-guide writers began to lose some of their influence.
There is no such thing as an abstract 'proper grammar'. What we have in the UK is more like a 'currently accepted grammar.' I would say that 'none are' is now part of this.

Cup cake · Answer

Thanks for some very interesting facts fivejedjon.

There's clearly a reason why over 90% of people choose to say - none are.
To me, 'none is' is the same as chalk being scraped down a blackboard; spine chilling.

Glad I'm not alone on this one.

Fivejedjon · Answer

Cup cakeTo me, 'none is' is the same as chalk being scraped down a blackboard; spine chilling. Glad I'm not alone on this one.

Actually, as a result of my formal education half a century and more ago, I'm a 'none is' person. I just happen to think that 'none are' is acceptable.

Tamguatlay · Answer

Where I live, "none is" is the version taught at schools."None are" is considered wrong.

Subject verb agreement

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