STOP LINGUISTIC RACISM. STOP RACISM.

Question

Wherever human exists, language exists and there are no "primitive" languages, because ALL LANGUAGES ARE EQUALLY COMPLEX AND EQUALLY CAPABLE OF EXPRESSING ANY IDEA IN THE UNIVERSE.
STOP LINGUISTIC RACISM (like any other form of racism). No language is better! Is an English speaker better than a Chinese speaker? Please, let's respect each other!
Maria Galian.

Usenet · Accepted Answer

REZA MODIRROUSTA wrote on 25 Apr 2005:
[nq:1]Wherever human exists, language exists and there are no "primitive" languages, because ALL LANGUAGES ARE EQUALLY COMPLEX AND EQUALLY CAPABLE ... No language is better! Is an English speaker better than a Chinese speaker? Please, let's respect each other! Maria Galian.[/nq]
misc.religion.sermon, alt.religion.sermon, misc.human.rights.rant, and alt.human.rights.rant probably don't exist yet, but you'd be the perfect person to introduce them.
You are, of course, mistaken when you say "ALL LANGUAGES ARE EQUALLY COMPLEX". Some languages are significantly more complex in some ways than other languages, which is evidenced by the fact that native speakers of unrelated languages have greater difficulty learning them. They may be more complex orthographically or phonetically or grammatically, but all languages are not absolutely equal in complexity.
When you assert "AND EQUALLY CAPABLE OF EXPRESSING ANY IDEA IN THE UNIVERSE", you commit the pathetic fallacy by atrtributing to languages the ability to express ideas. Only people express ideas, whether they use a natural human language or the "language" of music or painting or sculpture, for example.
And while it is true that all natural human languages can eventually be made to express any idea that humans can concoct, it is not at all true that they all can at the moment. The expression of ideas is not solely a function of the grammar of a language. The language also has to have the necessary vocabulary, and not all languages are currently equally endowed with the same vocabulary.
In addition, not all languages can express the same ideas in exactly the same way. Languages are tied to cultures, not to Platonic forms in the ether, so the way they express the same idea will vary according to culture.
And some languages are easier to use than others. Welsh, for example, has extraodinarily long words and so would be a poor choice for printers. English spelling is not phonetic, so one cannot figure out how to pronounce many of its words, unlike Spanish spelling, which is phonetic. Many Bantu languages use clicks that can be learned only before the age of 12 (true for most people) and so would make them less than desirable to use as the international language. Many languages are not written and so would be useless for international communication in the sciences.
And just to clue you in about the word "racism", language and "race" are purely coincidental. There is no such thing as "linguistic racism". That is a non sequitur.
Maybe you'd better stop, think, and learn a bit before you go around shouting about things you have no knowledge or understanding of. Your obnoxious moralism is as unwelcome here as it will be anywhere else fanatics and fanaticism are unwelcome.
If you feel that you are being discriminated against because of your language, there are rational ways to express your displeasure. Ranting and raving as you have done is not one of them.

Franke: EFL teacher & medical editor
For email, replace numbers with English alphabet.
"You've got to get over this idea that there's a rule for everything." Professor John Lawler, U. Michigan

Usenet · Answer

I believe different people have different culture, history and language, etc. How do they think determines their language, while their language shapes their thinking. So, we can not simply say ALL LANGUAGES ARE EQUALLY COMPLEX AND EQUALLY CAPABLE OF EXPRESSING ANY IDEA IN THE UNIVERSE. We can see this by learning two totally different languages. My native language is Chinese. I have learned English for many years. There are some different concepts in Chinese, but English speakers do not differentiate them, because English does not distinguish them, and vice versa. For example, it's hard for English speakers to NOTICE the three kinds of "uncle" in Chinese. There are many such examples.

Usenet · Answer

You have been learning English for many years, Kevin. It's often hard for non-native speakers to NOTICE the differences between the present perfect simple and progressive. There are many such examples.

In our local EFL newspaper here in Greece, we've seen a series of articles regarding the vast superiority of Greek to all other languages. Native speakers, strangers in a strange land, have been attempting to cautiously rein in the author of these articles. I'm sick to death of reading about such jingoist notions and I would very much prefer not to read about them here. I suspect that the aforementioned fanatic is just trying to twist our tail and check our reactions regarding this topic.

Usenet · Answer

[nq:1]You have been learning English for many years, Kevin. It's often hard for non-native speakers to NOTICE the differences between the present perfect simple and progressive. There are many such examples.[/nq]
I agree with you here. I my last post, I remember I have an 'and vice versa' before my example. My intention is to cover your cases. I am sorry if my writing misled you. Kevin

Usenet · Answer

[nq:1]In our local EFL newspaper here in Greece, we've seen a series of articles regarding the vast superiority of Greek to all other languages.[/nq]
As a Greek-American, it's a typical Greek cultural idea both in Greece and the USA. And its not just with language. But you do see this with people of every group, everywhere. Sometimes it's pride, other times it to feel better than another group or maybe that's just human nature. Who knows....

Usenet · Answer

"Eva" (Email Removed) wrote >
[nq:1]"credoquaabsurdum" [nq:2]In our local EFL newspaper here in Greece, we've seen a series of articles regarding the vast superiority of Greek to all other languages.[/nq]
[nq:1]As a Greek-American, it's a typical Greek cultural idea both in Greece and the USA. And its not just with ... Sometimes it's pride, other times it to feel better than another group or maybe that's just human nature. Who knows....[/nq]
I understand the French is one of those who are very proud of their language. Unfortunately, perhaps more English than the French migrate to America. Though the years, this end up making English the universal language of the Internet and international business.

The population of China is very huge and it is a growing economic powerhouse. The language is increasingly used on the Internet and for international business. But English is already very well established. And Chinese being non-alphabetic is more difficult than many other languages to learn and write. It is also more difficult to type on the keyboard. The Japanese language shares much of these difficulties.

Just my 2 cents on a lazy afternoon.
John

Usenet · Answer

YOU ARE RIGHT, I AM TRYING TO FIND OUT PEOPLE'S OPINIONS ON UNIVERSAL GRAMMAR THEORIES.

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Good luck, Reza, or Maria. I wish you the best of luck in your search for people's opinions regarding universal grammar. I'm sure you will find many interesting people with the same interests all over the world who will eagerly debate the merits of universal grammar with you and any and all reservations they might have regarding it. Personally speaking, I have no opinion whatsoever regarding the matter. This is the first time in five years that I've heard of Greenberg.

Usenet · Answer

credoquaabsurdum wrote on 27 Apr 2005:
[nq:1]Good luck, Reza,[/nq]
Reza is her husband's name. It is a common name for men in Iran. The ex-Shah of Iran was named Reza Palavi, I believe.
[nq:1]or Maria. I wish you the best of luck in your search for people's opinions regarding universal grammar. I'm sure ... have no opinion whatsoever regarding the matter. This is the first time in five years that I've heard of Greenberg.[/nq]
Franke: EFL teacher & medical editor
For email, replace numbers with English alphabet.
"You've got to get over this idea that there's a rule for everything." Professor John Lawler, U. Michigan

Usenet · Answer

Frankly, my dear...
Do you concur?

STOP LINGUISTIC RACISM. STOP RACISM.

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