Some very basic grammar questions

Question

Hope that someone could answer these very basic English grammar questions (feeling a bit embarrassed posting them here....

):

A. I left university before I had taken the final exam.
B. I left university before I took the final exams.

A. She sacked him before he had had a chance to explain his behavior.
B. She sacked him before he had a chance to explain his behavior.

Are they all grammatically correct or only A is correct?

Thanks!

Doll · Accepted Answer

Hello, welcome to EF.

nokia My try:

A. I left university before I had taken the final exam. --- Doesn't sound right to me. The precedence of the the events is important here. First off you should deide which event happens first. For this sentece I would write " I had left university before I took the final exam." First you leave university.

B. I left university before I took the final exams. ---- This sentence doesn't sound wrong to me but not as detailed as the sentence I wrote.

A. She sacked him before he had had a chance to explain his behavior. My comments with these sentences are the same with the previous ones.

B. She sacked him before he had a chance to explain his behavior.

Avangi · Answer

Doll's point seems perfectly correct, but for some reason my ear accepts the "A." examples.  I thought I had it figured out, but I guess I'll have to think again.    - A.

Newguest · Answer

Hi

I would say: I had left the university before I took the final exam. OR I left the university before taking the final exam

She had sacked him before he had a chance to explain his behaviour

Clive · Answer

Hi guys,

A. I left university before I had taken the final exam.

B. I left university before I took the final exams.

A. She sacked him before he had had a chance to explain his behavior.

B. She sacked him before he had a chance to explain his behavior.

Are they all grammatically correct or only A is correct?

They are all OK.
The Past Perfect is often not used when a word 'like 'before' or 'after' makes the sequence of events clear.

Best wishes, Clive

Newguest · Answer

Hi

It seems to me that it is incorrect to use "I had taken" in the first example because first I left the university and only then could I take an exam, not the other way round. So I would say either I had left the university before I took the final exam OR I left the university before I took the final exam.

The same with: She sacked him before he HAD HAD a chance to explain his behaviour. ----personally I see no reason for using "had had a chance" I would rather say: She HAD sacked him.... (because it happened first before he managed to explain himself) OR I would say: She sacked him before he had a chance to explain his behaviour, but I wouldn't use "had had a chance"

Thanks

Newguest · Answer

Newguest
Hi

It seems to me that it is incorrect to use "I had taken" in the first example because first I left the university and only then could I take an exam, not the other way round. So I would say either I had left the university before I took the final exam OR I left the university before I took the final exam.

The same with: She sacked him before he HAD HAD a chance to explain his behaviour. --personally I see no reason for using "had had a chance" I would rather say: She HAD sacked him.. (because it happened first before he managed to explain himself) OR I would say: She sacked him before he had a chance to explain his behaviour, but I wouldn't use "had had a chance"

Thanks

Do you agree with me guys?

Philip · Answer

CliveHi guys,

A. I left university before I had taken the final exam.

B. I left university before I took the final exams.

A. She sacked him before he had had a chance to explain his behavior.

B. She sacked him before he had a chance to explain his behavior.

Are they all grammatically correct or only A is correct?

They are all OK.
The Past Perfect is often not used when a word 'like 'before' or 'after' makesthe sequence of events clear.

Best wishes, Clive

My question: is there a sequence of events? If he didn't take the exam, the clause should be without taking the final exam, to be specific and not misleading. I find this type of thing [I'd call it a mistake] quite often, and it bugs me no end.

Doll · Answer

Hi Clive,

Could you give us more explanation about your points because I afree Newguest and I didn't understand your reason. (Should I use a question mark?)

Take care.

CalifJim · Answer

They are all correct.
For lengthier discussions with lots of examples of the use of the past perfect tense after before,
see and .
This is a common pattern for expressing "interruptive relationships" between actions. (Leaving university "interrupts" the normal course of events which would have led to exams; the sacking "interrupts" the normal course of events which would have led to an explanation of the behavior.) The main clause contains the "interrupting" action. The before clause contains the "interrupted" action. Because the interrupted action has not taken place, the past perfect may be considered a way of expressing a counterfactual, that is, it may be considered a subjunctive with family resemblances to the if clause of the third conditional, thus: if I had taken the final exam or if he had had a chance to explain.

CJ

Avangi · Answer

nokiathese very basic English grammar questions (feeling a bit embarrassed posting them here.. ):

Hi, nokia. As you can see, there was no reason to feel embarrassed! - A.

Some very basic grammar questions

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