Science Disproves Evolution

Question

Do you believe evolution is true? 2If so, then provide an answer to the following questions. "Evolution" in this context is the idea that natural, undirected processes are sufficient to account for the existence of all natural things:Information from Randomness?Information theory states that "information" never arises out of randomness or chance events. Our human experience verifies this every day. How can the origin of the tremendous increase in information from simple organisms up to man be accounted for? Information is always introduced from the outside. It is impossible for natural processes to produce their own actual information, or meaning, which is what evolutionists claim has happened. Random typing might produce the string "dog", but it only means something to an intelligent observer who has applied a definition to this sequence of letters. The generation of information always requires intelligence, yet evolution claims that no intelligence was involved in the ultimate formation of a human being whose many systems contain vast amounts of information.Life from dead chemicals?Evolutionists claim that life formed from non-life (dead chemicals), so-called "abiogenesis", even though it is a biological law ("BIOGENESIS") that LIFE ONLY COMES FROM LIFE. The probability of the simplest imaginable replicating system forming by itself from non- living chemicals has been calculated to be so very small as to be essentially zero - much less than one chance in the number of electron- sized particles that could fit in the entire visible universe! Given these odds, is it reasonable to believe that life formed itself?Complex DNA and RNA by chance?The continued existence (the reproduction) of a cell requires both DNA (the "plan") and RNA (the "copy mechanism"), both of which are tremendously complex. How reasonable is it to believe that these two co-dependent necessities came into existence by chance at exactly the same time?How did life become complex?We know and appreciate the tremendous amount of intelligent design and planning that went into landing a man on the moon. Yet the complexity of this task pales in comparison to the complexity of even the simplest life form. How reasonable is it to believe that purely natural processes, with no designer, no intelligence, and no plan, produced a human being?

Usenet · Accepted Answer

[nq:1]Do you believe evolution is true? 2[/nq]
The avian flu (H5N1) virus sure seems to think so. It's a couple of mutations aeway from being transmissible from human to human. Scientists think it's only a matter of time before it does. They're rushing to find a vaccine to prevent millions of deaths worldwide when it does.

Of course, people who don't believe in evolution can keep walking around unprotected. I'm sure they'll voluntarily refuse vaccination against this non-existent mutation.
jaybhee

Usenet · Answer

[nq:1]Do you believe evolution is true?[/nq]
Yes. I teach evolution.
99% of biologists think the scientific evidence and thus science proves evolution.
95% of scientists think the scientific evidence and thus proves evolution.
It is usually those not aware of the massive amount of evidence supporting evolution that do not believe in evolution, coupled with the immense time span (billions of years) involved that the human mind has a very hard time grasping, coupled with the religious fervor causing humans to choose to believe in invisible sky gods and magical belief over natural causes of life's origin and diversity on earth. ~Randall

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@reader1.panix.com:
[nq:1]It is usually those not aware of the massive amount of evidence supporting evolution that do not believe in evolution, ... choose to believe in invisible sky gods and magical belief over natural causes of life's origin and diversity on earth.[/nq]
I see and hear a lot of people using the same kind of m/d/isinformation to argue that the polar ice caps melting due to global warming will not cause world-wide flooding. They put ice in a glass of water, let it melt, and conclude that the water level has not risen. But most of the glaciers (including Greenland) are above the water level, unlike the ice cubes in that glass of water.
jaybee

Usenet · Answer

[nq:1]@reader1.panix.com:[/nq]
[nq:2]It is usually those not aware of the massive amount ... over natural causes of life's origin and diversity on earth.[/nq]
[nq:1]I see and hear a lot of people using the same kind of m/d/isinformation to argue that the polar ice ... most of the glaciers (including Greenland) are above the water level, unlike the ice cubes in that glass of water.[/nq]
And then there's the "expanding earth" crowd who insist that the theory of plate tectonics is false: the continents spread apart because the earth is blowing up like a balloon.

Even sillier, there are those who believe that MS Vista was worth the wait.

"He that is giddy thinks the world turns round."
William Shakespeare

Usenet · Answer

[nq:1]Even sillier, there are those who believe that MS Vista was worth the wait.[/nq]
Ixnay on Istavay. It's an argument against evolution.
jaybee

Usenet · Answer

[nq:1]And then there's the "expanding earth" crowd who insist that the theory of plate tectonics is false: the continents spread apart because the earth is blowing up like a balloon.[/nq]
That's just silly. I mean, it suggests that earth isn't even flat.

"Anybody can direct. There are only 11 good writers." â?? Mel Brooks

Usenet · Answer

[nq:1]Information theory states that "information" never arises out of randomness or chance events.[/nq]
No it doesn't.
-Ron

Usenet · Answer

[nq:2]Information theory states that "information" never arises out of randomness or chance events.[/nq]
[nq:1]No it doesn't. -Ron[/nq]
Yeah, well Chaos Theory says that chaos will eventually decay into order. Been waiting for that to happen to my desk for months now!

Caroline
So much for scientific theories...

Usenet · Answer

[nq:1]Do you believe evolution is true?[/nq]
Yes I do. Do you (or an creationists reading this) believe in magical causation of the variety of life on earth that goes against massive evidence for natural causation by means of evolution? If you do, if you believe in creation by a ***, which often entails Noah and the Ark and all that, I would love to see an intelligent response to the following questions:
"Some Questions for Creationists/Creationism": I would like those proponents of creationism to answer as many of these questions as possible, questions that involve science as compared to discussing the veracity or not of stories. Feel free to consult google or spiritual leaders. The point here is to look at scientific reasoning to filter out what science can explain compared to creationism. Any reference to an "ark", "flood", and so on is purely for the point of logical argument and is not meant to endorse that such events really happened.
1. Explain how the ecological food chain worked after the Flood andthe departure of the animals from the ark, since ecology demands a ratio of a few predators to many prey. What did all of the carnivores eat after leaving the Ark? (remember, all the vegetation was killed off from the Flood, and once they left the ark to repopulate, the carnivores no longer had the hay and grain handouts from Noah; the only "meat" prey (food) were the male and female of each herbivore, or other carnivores, which were needed for repopulating their "kind" on the earth).
2. Creationists argue that genetic mutations are harmful, so thatgenetic variablility, natural selection, and evolution is untenable. If that were true, explain how the degree of genetic variation in animals that currently exists resulted from the few of each kind in the Ark (2 of each "kind", or perhaps 7 of each kind, depending on which version of the Genesis story you read (there are two versions of the ark story in Genesis)).
3. According to the bible, the flood extended "over the highestmountains," or roughly 30,000 feet above present sea level, the rain fell for 40 days and 40 nights = 40 24-hour days = 960 hours, so it is easy to calculate the rate of the rainfall: 30,000/960 = 31.25 feet of water fell per hour. That is a little more than six inches of rainfall per minute. Where did all that water go?
4. Is there a consistent reading of the Flood story of Genesis? Howmany of each kind of clean animal went on the Ark? Present a calendar of the events of the Flood from the birth of Noah through the birth of Arpachshad (sometimes called Arphaxad, grandson of Noah), paying special attention as to the day when Noah entered the Ark and how long the Flood lasted. If you change the text of Genesis, give a reason for the change other than the need to fit your beliefs.5. How, during a worldwide flood, when seawater and freshwater wouldbe pretty much thoroughly mixed, would any fish survive? Saltwater fish are adapted physiologically for saltwater, and freshwater fish for freshwater; during the mixing of freshwater and saltwater (and megatons of mud making it rather difficult for any fish to see any food or prey in the water, let along extract oxygen efficiently through waterflow through their gills) from a global flood, the water osmolarity would be completely disrupted making it inhabitable to both categories of fish.

Also the muddied waters (from 6 inches of rain falling per minute over the land for 40 days) would have made the waters inhabitable to corals, jellyfish, and most marine invertebrates so why do all of those "kinds" of sea life exist today (I am assuming Noah did not construct a Seaworld aquarium on the ark to preserve marine life or freshwater aquatic organisms that the mudwater and brackish water would have killed off)?
6. G'day. It is quite a distance (9000 miles) from Mt. Ararat (wherethe ark allegedly landed) to Australia. How did one of Noah's sons herd all those wombats, platypi, and wallabies down there, without any breeding and distribution of those unique animals to the rest of the world (they are only found in Australia, including any fossils of them as predicted by island speciation mechanisms of evolution)?
7. Koalas they live only in Australia. Their diet is so restricted to a few subspecies of eucalyptus plant (they eat a pound of it each day) that they're threatened now by destruction of the only kinds of tree they will eat eucalyptus. It's hard to imagine them migrating, as they rest motionless for about 20 hours a day, sleeping most of that time. Over many generations they might slowly spread through an area but travelers, they ain't.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Koala#Ecology and behaviour But if the koalas did migrate over 9,000 miles from Ararat to New South Wales, eating a convenient trail of long-disappeared eucalyptus (which took how many years after the Flood to grow?), they left no trail of koala fossils behind. Since a koala requires a pound of eucalyptus each day, two would require 2#/day, so to transport 2 koalas to the land down under, 9000 miles from Ararat (ark ground zero) at a liberal travel rate (carried on the back of one of Noah's sons, since koalas hardly move at all) of 20 miles/day would mean Noah's son(s) would need to have brought along 900 lbs of eucalyptus for the koalas (plus freshwater (destroyed from the mixing of saltwater with freshwater)) for a 9000 mile journey that would have taken 450 days to complete one way.

I do not recall any recorded stories of such lengthy journeys by Noah's sons, so it is possible the koalas made the trip on their own, but then why didn't they leave relatives behind? (as it would have taken them years or even decades to make it to the land down under)
8. No worries mate. Let's move on to another creature, the Sloth. Iam curious how Noah's other son made the trip to deliver two Sloths to the only place they exist, South American jungles (of course there was no jungle habitat after the Flood that wiped out all vegetation, so I am not sure what habitat was there for the Sloth so that it could feed on the leaves it eats specially those of the cecropia tree), many thousands of miles across an ocean (since sloths move at about 1/10th mph someone had to deliver them across the world to S. America). http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sloth
9. There are between 3 million (conservative) and 50 million speciesof organisms on our planet; perhaps a billion or more species have existed based on the fossil record. Noah and his family were given 7 days (7 days x 24hrs/day x 60min/hr x 60sec/min = 604,800 seconds) to load the animals, birds, and creeping things into the ark. Loading one of each thing into the ark every 10 seconds (they would be very good dock workers if they could manage this) in the 604,800 seconds of allowed time they could load a maximum of 30,240 species (I am not even sure number crunching would allow that many species to fit in the ark as described).30,240 species x 10seconds/species = 302,400 seconds 302,400 seconds/species x 2 of each = 604,800 seconds (7 days) If the above scenario were true, then how did the 5-50 million of our existing species, or the 1 billion+ species that have existed, come about, if not from evolution? Speciation, including its required beneficial mutations, natural selection, genetic drift, island speciation, genetic variability, and the whole host of concepts inherent in evolution must have happened.

If there is another explanation it would be enlightening to know. To claim that such evolution is simply microevolution and not macroevolution denies all the concepts of evolution needed for speciation; macroevolution is simply a continuation of microevolution over time. Plus, since the marine invertebrate life would have been destroyed, it must have evolved since the Flood which would have involved macroevolution (the evolution of new "kinds" or major new groups of life).
10. Why is there the present distribution of animals and plants in theworld?
* How is it that marsupials are restricted to Australia and nearby islands and the Americas, monotremes are restricted to Australia, and few placental mammals are native only to Australia? * Why are tomatoes and potatoes native to the Americas only? (This is not a question merely of how they could have arrived there, it is also of why only there.)
11. Why is there the remarkable coherence among many different datingmethods: radioactivity, tree rings, ice cores, corals, supernovas from astronomy, biology, physics, geology, chemistry and archeology? (This is not answered by saying that there is no proof of uniformity of radioactive decay. The question is why all these different methods give the same answers.)

Usenet · Answer

[nq:2]Do you believe evolution is true?[/nq]
[nq:1]Yes I do. Do you (or an creationists reading this) believe in magical causation of the variety of life on ... entails Noah and the Ark and all that, I would love to see an intelligent response to the following questions:[/nq]
Sorry for hoisting your thread, Randall, but you're treading on Holy Ground here. Noah's Ark is one of the best stories our culture has ever come up with here. So atheist though I be I have to come to the defense: You put a hurtin' on Noah, you gonna to answer to me.Okay, so the early compilers of The Bible pulled their punch on some stories, but on the story of Noah's Ark they nailed it. Fist, they don't pick the king, or some great prophet, they choose as their hero some nobody in the middle of the desert; a chubby, schlubby middle-aged (500 years old?) guy I see Kevin Costner, 'cause it has that "if you build it they will come" sort of feel. This is real Hero's Journey material. Then they give him, a man with no particular access to, say, trees or shipbuilding skills, the task of building not just a boat, but the biggest boat ever built in the history of mankind.

The story has **scale**. Okay, the backstory says that mankind has only been around for a few verses, so they're all probably still camped out at the edges of The Garden hoping that He changes his mind and lets them back in, but still, it IS the entire history of mankind.

Anyway, back to the main plot. Noah gets the call. Shem and Ham quit their jobs at Gideon's Big and Tall Shop, and Japheth is called back from orthodontist school (plants a little resentment, to be used later). They collect up about 4 million board feet of shipbuilding timber okay, small technical problem here... Where are the trees? Maybe they sneak back into The Garden? *** catches them and is about to smite them, but, they ask, what were we supposed to do for timber Big Guy? We're shepherds. They hug it out. Ham grabs a few spare apples on the way back...

So they build a boat. We get a few false starts. First one sinks. Then those perennial rascals, the Philistines, steal the finished product. But in surprise turnaround we discover Noah's been building TWO boats and the Phillies took the trick one. They sink to their deaths. Hebrews rally around ol' Noah in triumph and help put the finishing touches on the decking, the cathead and rails...
So the boat's finished and the animals arrive. Magically, the all fit. Call in experts from California Closets. Any New Yorker could make this work: 9 rooms in 700 square feet? No problems. Nice little spa for the girls. What do the lions and tigers eat? How about all those creatures who didn't make it off the boat: hippogriffs, griffons, heffalumps, unicorns... All the stuff we don't have anymore, they got sacrificed for the greater good.
Anyway, The Big Guy applies the final coat of Polyurethane to the outside once they're all in (resolve why He didn't help more to begin with... Busy elsewhere, smiting Heathens, counting hairs on heads, &tc.)

Then it rains. 40 days and nights is just a metaphor in ancient Hebrew. Rain isn't visual. Let's shorten this. Lots of water comes down. Very wet. Ask Verbinski how to do this. On the positive side we get a lot of wet togas. Can Jessica Alba do Hebrew? Get some test shots...

Then, sunshine, doves, olive branches, Mt. Ararat. Everyone gets out and stretches. Animals frolic. Hand of *** puts each animal where it belongs (there, that answers most of the "technical" criticism from so-called scientists. You think everything The Big Guy does goes into The Book? You know I'm right, you big cry-babies).
And then, when it's all over, Noah, Shem, Ham and Japheth and their hot wives need to re-populate the world! As Osgood Fielding III the would say, "Zowie!" Did someone say edgy?! I'm seeing Ron Jeremy as Japheth. Jay-Dude. We need some serious, hot, repopulation action.

Real Estate's cheap, everyone's happy. Noah plants some vines right away, harvests, makes wine, gets drunk. Ham laughs at dad, gets banished or cursed or something. Sets up sequel.
Producer's notes follow:
[nq:1]1. Explain how the ecological food chain worked after the Flood and the departure of the animals from the ark, ... the male and female of each herbivore, or other carnivores, which were needed for repopulating their "kind" on the earth).[/nq]
Purina *** Chow. Bit of manna from heaven until the crops come in. Hand of *** works in mysterious ways and such.
[nq:1]2. Creationists argue that genetic mutations are harmful, so that genetic variablility, natural selection, and evolution is untenable. If that ... depending on which version of the Genesis story you read (there are two versions of the ark story in Genesis)).[/nq]
That's not the worst of it. You've got to account for all the alleles in the genome: Let's say that all eight people on the Ark were unrelated. That means that each of them could have carried 2 different alleles for each gene or a total of 16 alleles for the entire population. Since the human genome encompasses up to 59 different alleles for some genes, where did the other
43 alleles come from?

You've got 4 choices:
1) there were more than 30 people on the Ark (and Scripture is fallible)
2) the Flood didn't cover the entire world and at least 22 other humanssurvived (and Scripture is fallible)
3) 43 different alleles EVOLVED after the Food.
4) *** works in mysterious ways.

We'll go with 4 on this one.
[nq:1]3. According to the bible, the flood extended "over the highest mountains," or roughly 30,000 feet above present sea level, ... per hour. That is a little more than six inches of rainfall per minute. Where did all that water go?[/nq]
Early humans were very wasteful. Deepest apologies. We shouldn't have washed our donkey carts so often...
[nq:1]4. Is there a consistent reading of the Flood story of Genesis? How many of each kind of clean animal ... you change the text of Genesis, give a reason for the change other than the need to fit your beliefs.[/nq]
Yadda yadda. Hand of ***, &etc...
[nq:1]5. How, during a worldwide flood, when seawater and freshwater would be pretty much thoroughly mixed, would any fish survive? ... the ark to preserve marine life or freshwater aquatic organisms that the mudwater and brackish water would have killed off)?[/nq]
Can fish hold their breath? Or gills, or whatever they do? Get fact-checking to come up with something... Maybe Noah kept trout in special tanks onboard? After all, The Book says two of each creature, not just the land-based ones. Take that Evolutionists: Noah had aquariums.
[nq:1]6. G'day. It is quite a distance (9000 miles) from Mt. Ararat (where the ark allegedly landed) to Australia. How ... ocean (since sloths move at about 1/10th mph someone had to deliver them across the world to S. America). [/nq]
Distribution of animals made by Pterydactyls and other large, winged creatures. Hence them all dying after delivering animals to new locations: they were exhausted into extinction. Sad, but all part of The Big Plan. Ya gotta break some eggs & all that...
[nq:1]9. There are between 3 million (conservative) and 50 million species of organisms on our planet; perhaps a billion or ... as described). 30,240 species x 10seconds/species = 302,400 seconds 302,400 seconds/species x 2 of each = 604,800 seconds (7 days)[/nq]
C'mon. Have you seen New Yorkers cram onto an A train? Give people a deadline, they'll make it happen.
[nq:1]If the above scenario were true, then how did the 5-50 million of our existing species, or the 1 billion+ ... evolved since the Flood which would have involved macroevolution (the evolution of new "kinds" or major new groups of life).[/nq]
Isn't this a sequel question?
[nq:1]10. Why is there the present distribution of animals and plants in the world? * How is it that marsupials ... (This is not a question merely of how they could have arrived there, it is also of why only there.)[/nq]
Because that's where *** put them. I dunno... Pteradactyl **** spreads things in funny patterns.
[nq:1]11. Why is there the remarkable coherence among many different dating methods: radioactivity, tree rings, ice cores, corals, supernovas ... is no proof of uniformity of radioactive decay. The question is why all these different methods give the same answers.)[/nq]
All I can say is that if I gave the same answers on all my SAT questions, I'd still be running a bolt driver in the Rouge plant. What's so great about giving the same answer?
I hope you're satisfied and ready for your baptism now.

Alan Brooks

A with an Underwood
42
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Science Disproves Evolution

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