Schadenfreude

Question

Hi all,is there anybody with full version of OED that could tell me the full etymology for the word "Schadenfreude"? While I do know it's origin is German -schaden = harm, freude= joy, but I'd like to know the full origins for it.Also, while the feeling of "schadenfreude" is undoubtedly universal, how come there's no real good single word for it in English? Or is there? thanks,-Kthere are only letters in my email

Usenet · Accepted Answer

[nq:1]Hi all, is there anybody with full version of OED that could tell me the full etymology for the word ... real good single word for it in English? Or is there? thanks, -K there are only letters in my email[/nq]
Here's the full OED entry:
(Ger., f. schaden harm + freude joy.)
Malicious enjoyment of the misfortunes of others.
(1852 R. C. TRENCH Study of Words (ed. 3) II. 29 What a fearful thing is it that any language should have a word expressive of the pleasure which men feel at the calamities of others; for the existence of the word bears testimony to the existence of the thing. And yet in more than one such a word is found... In the Greek{elenis}{pi}{iota}{chi}{alpha}{iota}{rho}{epsilon}{kappa}{alpha}{kappa}{giacu}{alpha}, in the German, ?Schadenfreude?. 1867 CARLYLE Shooting Niagara: & After? III. 12 Have not I a kind of secret satisfaction, of the malicious or even of the judiciary kind (schadenfreude, ?mischief-joy?, the Germans call it, but really it is justice-joy withal), that he they call ?Dizzy? is to do it.) 1895 C. LOWE German Emperor William II ix. 256 But the Schadenfreude, or malicious joy, of the French was premature.

1901 Q. Rev. CXCIII. 316 Sometimes it (sc. Queen Victoria's smile) would be coyly negative, leading the speaker on, the lips slightly opened, with a suggestion of kindly fun, even of a little innocent Schadenfreude. 1902 Contemp. Rev. May 662, I am persuaded that what (no doubt by a slip of undesigned candour) is described in the recent Life of Claude Bernard by an eminent English physiologist as the ?Joys of the Laboratory?, are very real ?joys? to the vivisector; that is, Schadenfreude,{em}Pleasure in the Pain he witnesses and creates.

1902 C. HAGUE tr. Brentano's Origin of Knowledge of Right & Wrong 85 Pleasure at the misfortunes of others (Schadenfreude) is bad on the first ground. 1920 F. HAMILTON Days before Yesterday iv. 118 The particular sentiment described in German as ?schadenfreude? ?pleasure over another's troubles? (how characteristic it is that there should be no equivalent in any other language for this peculiarly Teutonic emotion!) makes but little appeal to the average Briton except where questions of age and of failing powers come into play.

1939 Palestine Post 31 Aug. 6/3 There appears to be a certain amount of ?Schadenfreude? in London..at Germany's failure to get the German-Soviet Pact ratified. 1947 AUDEN Age of Anxiety (1948) I. 14 The Schadenfreude of cooks at keyholes. 1974 K. CLARK Another Part of Wood i. 8 Arthur Rackham..certainly had a vein of schadenfreude (what is now misleadingly described as sadism) and took an intense delight in scraggy fingers. 1977 ?E. CRISPIN? Glimpses of Moon iv.

62 Solidarity or no solidarity, Widger was not wholly without Schadenfreude at seeing his informative colleague discomfited for once. 1978 ?A. STUART? Vicious Circles 15 For a Russian..there is a curious fascination, mixed with Schadenfreude, about..titles and honours lists.

Laura
(emulate St. George for email)

Usenet · Answer

[nq:1]Hi all, is there anybody with full version of OED that could tell me the full etymology for the word ... "schadenfreude" is undoubtedly universal, how come there's no real good single word for it in English? Or is there? thanks,[/nq]
Schadenfreude is a good English (and also Dutch) word,

Jan

"Schadenvreugde is ja overhoofd de schoonste vreugde."

Usenet · Answer

[nq:2]Hi all, is there anybody with full version of OED ... single word for it in English? Or is there? thanks,[/nq]
[nq:1]Schadenfreude is a good English (and also Dutch) word,[/nq]
According to your temporary signature:
"Schadenvreugde is ja overhoofd de schoonste vreugde." the word is not exactly identical. In Swedish, we have it as "skadeglädje". The Swedish word most similar to "Freude" is "fröjd", which is not used much nowadays.

Usenet · Answer

[nq:1]Also, while the feeling of "schadenfreude" is undoubtedly universal, how come there's no real good single word for it in English? Or is there?[/nq]
"Gloating" will do in some contexts, tho it tends to refer more to the outward signs of that inward state.

Joe Fineman joe (Email Removed)

Usenet · Answer

[nq:1]Also, while the feeling of "schadenfreude" is undoubtedly universal, how come there's no real good single word for it in English? Or is there?[/nq]
Genuinely useful new words are still coming
into existence: and when they do it is normal
for the new words to be borrowed into other
languages, e.g.
Hangar = French shed, used early for sheds used
to store aircraft, so English adopted it to mean a purpose-built building for aircraft. (Many technical terms for aviation are originally French e.g.
aeroplane, fuselage, etc.)
Feedback, extensively used in cybernetics,
originating in English, adopted by nearly all other modern languages.

Don Phillipson
Carlsbad Springs
(Ottawa, Canada)

Usenet · Answer

[nq:2]Schadenfreude is a good English (and also Dutch) word,[/nq]
[nq:1]According to your temporary signature: "Schadenvreugde is ja overhoofd de schoonste vreugde." the word is not exactly identical. In Swedish, we have it as "skadeglädje". The Swedish word most similar to "Freude" is "fröjd", which is not used much nowadays.[/nq]
The rest of the quote isn't too Dutch either.
Jan

Usenet · Answer

[nq:2]Hi all, is there anybody with full version of OED ... single word for it in English? Or is there? thanks,[/nq]
[nq:1]Schadenfreude is a good English (and also Dutch) word,[/nq]
No, I don't consider "schadenfreude" a good Dutch word. It is a germanism. The good Dutch word would be "leedvermaak", with leed=suffering and vermaak=enjoyment/pleasure/amusement.

Steven

Usenet · Answer

[nq:2]Schadenfreude is a good English (and also Dutch) word,[/nq]
[nq:1]No, I don't consider "schadenfreude" a good Dutch word. It is a germanism. The good Dutch word would be "leedvermaak", with leed=suffering and vermaak=enjoyment/pleasure/amusement.[/nq]
Swedish and for that matter even Finnish have a corresponding single word for Schadenfreude skadegladje (swe) and vahingonilo (fin). I'm still puzzled as to why there doesn't appear to be a single corresponding word for it in English.
-K

Usenet · Answer

[nq:1]Swedish and for that matter even Finnish have a corresponding single word for Schadenfreude skadegladje (swe) and vahingonilo (fin).[/nq]
Do those words predate the borrowing or awareness of the German word? Or are they local translations or substitutes inspired by the German word? Do you have access to dates? M-W says "schadenfreude" was borrowed into English in 1895, but that doesn't tell us how long it was used in German.
[nq:1]I'm still puzzled as to why there doesn't appear to be a single corresponding word for it in English.[/nq]
"Why isn't/wasn't there a word for ***?" is an nearly impossible question to answer. What possible reason could anyone give for a non-event that would satisfy you? Things like "I guess nobody thought of it"? Is that a reason?

Why not? Donna Richoux

Usenet · Answer

[nq:2]No, I don't consider "schadenfreude" a good Dutch word. It is a germanism. The good Dutch word would be "leedvermaak", with leed=suffering and vermaak=enjoyment/pleasure/amusement.[/nq]
[nq:1]Swedish and for that matter even Finnish have a corresponding single word for Schadenfreude skadegladje (swe) and vahingonilo (fin). I'm still puzzled as to why there doesn't appear to be a single corresponding word for it in English.[/nq]
Maybe because English is less inclined to compound words. None of the examples posted has, I think, been other than compound (I admit I can't analyse the Finnish).

Paul
In bocca al Lupo!

Schadenfreude

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