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Guest Posted 21 years ago
Grammar
"There/Here is" with plural subject allowed?
Hi there,
I am not a native english speaker and I find myself in a controversy discussion with a friend wether or not it is possible to use "there is" and "here is" with a plural subject, for example:
"There is some things I'd like to talk about."
"Here is your letters."
I looked for appropriate grammars or idioms via google, but failed to find anything conclusive.
I think it is just bad english (i.e. not even slang) and therefore all these sentences should use "are" instead of "is". But I also found a hint, that it might be allowed when offering something (see http://www.sulinet.hu/nyelvek/?p=content&id=762 ).
However, my friend was in the U.S. quite often and always for more than a month. He has the impression, that this use of "(t)here is" with plural subjects seems to be quite common.
So, today we watched a DVD of movie "Absolute Power" with english subtitles turned on, and there actually was the sentence "There is some things I'd like to talk about." written (and spoken), which actually was the cause for us to come up with this discussion.
Please help us to decide: Is it just a common mistake, that even native english speakers make, or is it actually correct english, and if so, when is it appropriate to use this form.
Thanks in advance
Ralf
I am not a native english speaker and I find myself in a controversy discussion with a friend wether or not it is possible to use "there is" and "here is" with a plural subject, for example:
"There is some things I'd like to talk about."
"Here is your letters."
I looked for appropriate grammars or idioms via google, but failed to find anything conclusive.
I think it is just bad english (i.e. not even slang) and therefore all these sentences should use "are" instead of "is". But I also found a hint, that it might be allowed when offering something (see http://www.sulinet.hu/nyelvek/?p=content&id=762 ).
However, my friend was in the U.S. quite often and always for more than a month. He has the impression, that this use of "(t)here is" with plural subjects seems to be quite common.
So, today we watched a DVD of movie "Absolute Power" with english subtitles turned on, and there actually was the sentence "There is some things I'd like to talk about." written (and spoken), which actually was the cause for us to come up with this discussion.
Please help us to decide: Is it just a common mistake, that even native english speakers make, or is it actually correct english, and if so, when is it appropriate to use this form.
Thanks in advance
Ralf
Top answer
Hi Ralf, You are both correct. They are still considered ungrammatical by many, and you would be wise to avoid them in careful writing; but the fact remains that the use of 'here/there is' (usually as 'here's/there's') with plural nouns is extremely common-- and acceptable-- informally. I use them myself frequently when I speak.
- Hi Ralf, You are both correct.
- They are still considered ungrammatical by many, and you would be wise to avoid them in careful writing; but the fact remains that the use of 'here/there is' (usually as 'here's/there's') with plural nouns is extremely common-- and acceptable-- informally.
- I use them myself frequently when I speak.
- r/ etc.
- We do not have the same anomaly in the case of 'this is / these are', which always agree with the number of their nouns.
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20 Answers
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Hi Ralf,
You are both correct. They are still considered ungrammatical by many, and you would be wise to avoid them in careful writing; but the fact remains that the use of 'here/there is' (usually as 'here's/there's') with plural nouns is extremely common-- and acceptable-- informally. I use them myself frequently when I speak.
My feeling is that the reason is primarily one
You are both correct. They are still considered ungrammatical by many, and you would be wise to avoid them in careful writing; but the fact remains that the use of 'here/there is' (usually as 'here's/there's') with plural nouns is extremely common-- and acceptable-- informally. I use them myself frequently when I speak.
My feeling is that the reason is primarily one
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Hello Guest
In BrE, you would always use 'here are your letters', 'there are some things we need to talk about', etc.
But the contracted singular form (e.g. 'here's your letters') is sometimes used with plurals in speech. You could call it 'informal' usage.
I'll be interested to hear what happens elsewhere.
MrP
In BrE, you would always use 'here are your letters', 'there are some things we need to talk about', etc.
But the contracted singular form (e.g. 'here's your letters') is sometimes used with plurals in speech. You could call it 'informal' usage.
I'll be interested to hear what happens elsewhere.
MrP
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Hi,
it's me, Ralf, the starter of this thread. Thanks for your answers so far. A post in another thread pointed me to the "American Heritage - Book of English Usage", where I found [url="http://www.bartleby.com/64/C001/063.html"]this section[/url]:
it's me, Ralf, the starter of this thread. Thanks for your answers so far. A post in another thread pointed me to the "American Heritage - Book of English Usage", where I found [url="http://www.bartleby.com/64/C001/063.html"]this section[/url]:
According to the standard rule, when
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Studies have shown that is very common in both formal and informal speech. What doesn't work for writing and or highly formal speaking has no bearing on what is used for normal everyday speech. Why? Because they are different. Rules that guide some aspects of language do not cover every aspect of language.
The CGEL describes it like this. It's not that forma
The CGEL describes it like this. It's not that forma
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There's with a plural subjedct is just damned wrong, formal or informal. It hurts my ear! That is the greatest test, to my mind. If it makes you queasy it is wrong. I believe it has been sheer laziness plus poor grammar grounding that have made the language less pleasurable to read and hear.
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Hi Ralf,
I'm an English teacher from Asia and I can relate to what you are talking about since I observe the same things from Americans, especially in movies. The words "here" and "there" are not subjects in a sentence. Therefore in the example you gave- There is some things I'd like to talk about.- if we are going to analyze it, the subject is "some things" (which is plural) and the ver
I'm an English teacher from Asia and I can relate to what you are talking about since I observe the same things from Americans, especially in movies. The words "here" and "there" are not subjects in a sentence. Therefore in the example you gave- There is some things I'd like to talk about.- if we are going to analyze it, the subject is "some things" (which is plural) and the ver
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AnonymousI hope I was able to clarify the use of there is/are with you.Just FYI. The original question was asked in January, 2005, nearly four years ago.
Chereque Navarro
CJ
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Anon:
You're a bit tardy. CJ's post was nearly 2 years ago, and he remarked that the original was 4 years before his.
You're a bit tardy. CJ's post was nearly 2 years ago, and he remarked that the original was 4 years before his.
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I believe this type of grammar is more often used with GROUPS of things and uncountable nouns.
Example "Here is the paperwork you asked for." / "Here's all of the papers you asked for."
As another person responded, it sounds more natural to use
APOSTROPHE + S (like the example above) because it is easier to pronounce than the correct way. It is grammatically incorrec
Example "Here is the paperwork you asked for." / "Here's all of the papers you asked for."
As another person responded, it sounds more natural to use
APOSTROPHE + S (like the example above) because it is easier to pronounce than the correct way. It is grammatically incorrec
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