Present Perfect 'when'

Question

Why is it that when the present perfect is a part of a 'when' (subordinate) clause, it expresses a future action?

For example: the past simple tense doesn't change when we make the clause a 'when' clause:

You drew the pictures=past time

When you drew the pictures=past time

But the time expressed by the present perfect changes when we make the clause a 'when' clause:

You have drawn the pictures=past time

When you have drawn the pictures=future time

Thank you very much in advance.

Avangi · Accepted Answer

My instinct is to say that the perfect tense indicates completion, but CJ says that's not so.

If you make your comparison between the present perfect and the past perfect, "when" means "after the completion" in both cases.
When I had drawn the pictures, I put my materials away.
When I have drawn the pictures, I shall put my materials away.
Both second events occur in the time frame following the drawing.

Both simple tenses do not exprerience the shift:
When you drew the pictures you needed a lot of light.
When you draw the pictures you need a lot of light. .

All I can do is describe it, which is what so many of the so-called rules do:

"When" plus a perfect tense seems to cause the time frame to end at the completion of the action.

English 1b3 · Answer

Yea, it seems to be the case regardless of the verb, so 'describing' is all we need

Ta

English 1b3 · Answer

When you watch the film, you will realize just how clever the Director is.

When you have watched the film, you will realize just how clever the Director is.

For learners, it almost seems necessary to think of the present perfect sometimes as a way to express completed actions. Otherwise, how would one know to choose the present perfect instead of the present simple above?

I mean, usually the present perfect expresses some action in the indefinite past; but here, the tense expresses an action that happens in the future

Avangi · Answer

English 1b3 When you watch the film, you will realize just how clever the Director is.

The "will" seems to be optional here.

But I think the meaning without the shift only describes habitual behavior.

Whenever one watches the film one realizes just how clever the director is.

When I take a shower I adjust the temperature so it's very hot.

Avangi · Answer

English 1b3 When you have watched the film, you will realize just how clever the Director is.

I'm afraid "to watch" must join "when" as a word with a built-in tense hook.

"When you watch" in the simple present can mean "while you are watching" or "when you have watched."

"To watch a movie" is like "to eat a banana."

"Were you just watching the movie?" "Were you just eating the banana?"

"Did you watch the movie?" "Did you eat the banana?"

These things are all ambiguous. Did you consume the whole thing or just nibble at it?

Present Perfect 'when'

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