Prepositions/relative clauses

Question

Prepositions.I saw the house in which he lived.Could this be seen as the object of the preposition, rather than a relative clause?Is this the only instance where a preposition can either precede or follow its object? **I ask because I want to know if there may be times where I cannot move the preposition away from the end of the sentence. That is, if there is no relative pronoun (including reduced relative clauses where there is an omitted pronoun),  where would the preposition go if I don't want to end the sentence with a preposition?Thanks

CalifJim · Accepted Answer

English 1b3I saw the house in which he lived.

Could this be seen as the object of the preposition, rather than a relative clause?

Absolutely not.

English 1b3Is this the only instance where a preposition can either precede or follow its object?

No. Didn't we go through this already in another thread? Consider questions.

In which house did he live? / Which house did he live in?
To what do we owe this honor? / What do we owe this honor to?
With what will we cut the bread? / What will we cut the bread with?

CJ

English 1b3 · Answer

Sorry, i forgot to include when asking questions.

Is there any other case? If there is, where would the preposition go, since there is no pronoun to put it before and since there is no question to place it infront of?

'of' here is probably just part of the verb, as you mentioned in the other post.

Ta

CalifJim · Answer

English 1b3Is there any other case?

I can't think of one. That doesn't mean there isn't one!

English 1b3there is no question to place it infront of?

'of' here is probably just part of the verb, as you mentioned in the other post.

Really? Which post? I don't believe ofis ever part of a verb, so I wonder why I said that.

CJ

English 1b3 · Answer

I can't find the post

But didn't you speak of prepositions that have to stick with the verb (sorry, not part of the verb phrase).

Isn't this an example of one?

CalifJim · Answer

English 1b3didn't you speak of prepositions that have to stick with the verb

Oh! I remember. That was about phrasal verbs. Phrasal verbs consist of a main verb and an adverbial particle like in, out, on, off, up, and down. "Adverbial particle" -- not "preposition" -- though it may look like a preposition. The "prepositions that have to stick with the verb" are actually not true prepositions. They're "particles". That's why they "have to stick with the verb".

throw out, put up, take down, look up, bring up, slow down, find out, ... are phrasal verbs.

I don't think there are any phrasal verbs which have the adverbial particle of, though there may be a rare few that escape me just now.

CJ

English 1b3 · Answer

since there is no question to place it infront of.

Where else can the preposition go then?

CalifJim · Answer

English 1b3Where else can the preposition go then?

I assume you mean to ask "Where else besides the end can the preposition of be placed in the clause
since there is no question to place it in front of ?

Answer: You can put it here if you want more formal style:

since there is no question in front of which to place it.

CJ

English 1b3 · Answer

since there is no question in front of which to place it.

Thanks!

So it could also be:

since there is no question which to place it infront of.

--------------------------

This confuses me, since relative clauses usually use a finite verb, but this one has an infinitive...

If it were this, i would understand it:

since there is no question, which I can place it infront of.

since there is no question, infront of which I can place it.

-----------------------

What does the infinitive function as then?

Can you please help me get my head around this relative clause, please. That way, I can locate the omitted which in similar sentences, so that I can move the preposition before the pronoun.

CalifJim · Answer

English 1b3This confuses me, since relative clauses usually use a finite verb, but this one has an infinitive... ... Can you please help me get my head around this relative clause, please.

Like relative clauses, infinitives (or infinitive clauses) can be used to expand the meaning of the preceding noun; that is, they can be adjectival. Note these, and their paraphrases with relative clauses. Often the meaning involves can or could.

The children had a lot of toys to play with. ~ The children had a lot of toys which they could play with. ~ ... with which they could play.

Today the famous author has an interesting topic to write about. ~ Today the famous author has an interesting topic which he [wants to / can] write about. ~ ... about which he [wants to / can] write.
Fortunately, I had another set of clothes to change into. ~ Fortunately, I had another set of clothes which I could change into. ~ ... into which I could change.

All of the examples of adjectival infinitive clauses above have a preposition at the end. For a formal style you can move the preposition at the end of the infinitive clause so it's before the infinitive, but then you have to add which.

The children had a lot of toys with which to play.
Today the famous author has an interesting topic about which to write.
Fortunately, I had another set of clothes into which to change.
_____________

Note: If the preposition remains at the end, you cannot add which:

*The children had a lot of toys which to play with. - NO!
*Today the famous author has an interesting topic which to write about. - NO!
*Fortunately, I had another set of clothes which to change into. - NO!

______________

Similarly, if there is no preposition to move, you don't add which:

We have no place to go. - OK.
*We have no place which to go. - NO!
George had a statement to make. - OK.
*George had a statement which to make. - NO!
_______________

In your specific example, you may think of in front of as a compound preposition. Thus:

... no question to place it in front of. - OK.
... *no question which to place it in front of. - NO!
... no question in front of which to place it. - OK.

Compare:

a vase to put the flowers in - OK.
*a vase which to put the flowers in - NO!
a vase in which to put the flowers - OK.

In short, which is only added before the infinitive when there's a preposition before it, and this pattern is formal. For ordinary conversation, put the preposition at the end of the infinitive clause and don't use which.

CJ

English 1b3 · Answer

Wow!

Thanks a lot! Occasionally I would have a prepostion at the end of the setence, and there would be no relative clause infront of which to place the preposition! Now I know that it's because I didn't know this!!!

Very clear and informative, CJ. You receive a gold star.

Now I hope I receive a gold star for using the construction in this post, in bold above

Prepositions/relative clauses

Top answer

Get the Weekly English Kit 📬

Related Questions