Phonetics trouble

Question

Hi,I am absolutely troubled by translation of a number of words from phonetic script into ordinary english.Even worse, I do not even know how to transcribe them here! I do not know how to write with the phonetics on my computer.One word I am able to transcribe - is "pleiz" (like "place", but with "z" instead of "s" at the end. Which word is that?Another word is "pua" ... which word is that?Yet another is "hau". (My guess is that this is "how")ThanksSpiderman

Usenet · Accepted Answer

[nq:1]Hi, I am absolutely troubled by translation of a number of words from phonetic script into ordinary english. Even worse, ... to transcribe - is "pleiz" (like "place", but with "z" instead of "s" at the end. Which word is that?[/nq]
Perhaps "plays"?
Gerard van Wilgen

www.majstro.com (On-line translation dictionary / Enreta tradukvortaro) www.travlang.com/Ergane (Free translation dictionary for Windows / Senpaga tradukvortaro por Windows)

Usenet · Answer

[nq:1]One word I am able to transcribe - is "pleiz" (like "place", but with "z" instead of "s" at the end. Which word is that?[/nq]
plays
[nq:1]Another word is "pua" ... which word is that?[/nq]
No idea. Sounds like a British pronunciation.
[nq:1]Yet another is "hau". (My guess is that this is "how")[/nq]
Mine too.

Transpose hotmail and mxsmanic in my e-mail address to reach me directly.

Usenet · Answer

[nq:2]Hi, I am absolutely troubled by translation of a number ... instead of "s" at the end. Which word is that?[/nq]
[nq:1]Perhaps "plays"?[/nq]
Or 'please' or 'plies'. A dictionary that let you look up a word and then see the definitions and spellings of all the words that had the same consonants but different vowel sounds would be cool. Kind of like what they usually do in Arabic but optimized for English.

Usenet · Answer

[nq:1]Hi, I am absolutely troubled by translation of a number of words from phonetic script into ordinary english. Even worse, ... to transcribe - is "pleiz" (like "place", but with "z" instead of "s" at the end. Which word is that?[/nq]
As has already been suggested "plays"
[nq:1]Another word is "pua" ... which word is that?[/nq]
Probably "poor" (Received Pronunciation)
[nq:1]Yet another is "hau". (My guess is that this is "how")[/nq]
I agree,
Regards, Einde O'Callaghan

Usenet · Answer

[nq:1]Hi, I am absolutely troubled by translation of a number of words from phonetic script into ordinary english. Even worse, ... is "pua" ... which word is that? Yet another is "hau". (My guess is that this is "how") Thanks Spiderman[/nq]
This is a question I wanted to ask long ago..
Is there more than one phonetic alphabets?
The thing is that you go to one word in one diccionary and you get some symbols to achieve the proper pronunciation, but if you see the same word in another diccionary the symbols are different.

It seems as if every dictionary had its very own phontic alphabet.

I have here two diccionaries with the same word "measure" and the symbols are quite different...
http://dictionary.cambridge.org/define.asp?dict=CALD&key=49526&ph=on

http://www.bartleby.com/61/22/M0182200.html
Thanks.
Irma.

Usenet · Answer

[nq:1]Is there more than one phonetic alphabets?[/nq]
Yes.
The International Phonetic Alphabet is very widely used, but many dictionaries and other texts still use their own, home-cooked phonetic alphabets for transcribing pronunciation. This is common in English dictionaries, whereas, in the case of French dictionaries, for example, the IPA is typically used.
Many users of the IPA who transcribe only a single language with it make slight adjustments to it to make it more readable or easier to typeset. For example, many writers and publishers use 'r' to represent the sound of 'r' in their target language, even though the actual IPA uses a number of different symbols for this sound, depending on how it is made (there are separate symbols for uvular 'r', retroflex 'r', and so on). This is a bit unfortunate but it is widespread and usually it's not too confusing unless you are comparing two different languages.
[nq:1]The thing is that you go to one word in one diccionary and you get some symbols to achieve the proper pronunciation, but if you see the same word in another diccionary the symbols are different.[/nq]
In some languages these home-made symbols are common. It's very common in English dictionaries, I'm sorry to say. I think that the high proportion of monolingual writers and editors in English makes this problem worse, as they've never spoken any other language and have never had to learn the IPA and/or have never seen its utility.
[nq:1]It seems as if every dictionary had its very own phontic alphabet.[/nq]
In English dictionaries, this is often true.

Transpose hotmail and mxsmanic in my e-mail address to reach me directly.

Usenet · Answer

..
[nq:2]It seems as if every dictionary had its very own phontic alphabet.[/nq]
[nq:1]In English dictionaries, this is often true.[/nq]
Thanks a lot for your comment... I just searched for the IPA site and I got the complete chart and a lot more information.

BTW, for those who are intrested in the site... here is the link :-)

http://www2.arts.gla.ac.uk/IPA/ipa.html
Have a nice day!
Irma.

Usenet · Answer

Irma > misc.education.language.english
in <
[nq:1]Is there more than one phonetic alphabets?[/nq]
AFAIK, the International Phonetic Alphabet (IPA) is the international standard.
If you are using a newsreader with Unicode support ("40tude Dialog" for instance; OE too, but Dialog is better

), and you have a suitable font installed in your Control Panel / Fonts folder (Arialuni.ttf = Arial Unicode MS , for instance, or Lucida Sans Unicode), you can write and read IPA symbols even in Usenet posts.

Here is the IPA transcription of the sentence
"Good morning everybody!"
GÊ?d mÉ?ËnÉªÅ? É?vrÉªbÉ?dÉª
And here are some useful links
The English consonants and vowels in IPA symbols
http://www.phon.ucl.ac.uk/home/sampa/english-uni.htm

A Sound Reference to the IPA
http://www.ling.hf.ntnu.no/ipa/full/
The INTERNATIONAL PHONETIC ASSOCIATION Home Page
http://www2.arts.gla.ac.uk/IPA/ipa.html
The International Phonetic Alphabet in Unicode
http://www.phon.ucl.ac.uk/home/wells/ipa-unicode.htm

Setting up your computing for Unicode IPA
http://depts.washington.edu/llc/help/presentations/unicode ipa/2 getting started.html

Lucida Sans Unicode font, 316 KB download
http://www.phon.ucl.ac.uk/home/wells/lsansuni.ttf
Arialuni.ttf font (23MB d/load. You'll find it on Office 2000/XP CDs too).
http://driver.polri.go.id/Font/Arialuni.ttf
40tude Dialog - Windows newsreader with Unicode Character support http://www.40tude.com/dialog
[nq:1]The thing is that you go to one word in one diccionary and you get some symbols to achieve the proper pronunciation, but if you see the same word in another diccionary the symbols are different.[/nq]
I happened to notice that British dictionaries generally use IPA, and so do Italian dictionaries, while Americans still use their own symbols.

Enrico C

Usenet · Answer

"

Irma > misc.education.language.english in '.

Note that this only describes a small subset of the transcription system. There are far more sounds (used in other languages) and nuances of sound that can be captured. See the document describing the full standard for complete details.
Phonemic (broad) transcriptions are bracketed by '/.../'. Phonetic (narrow) transcriptions are bracketed by ''. Syllables that carry primary stress are preceded by "'". Syllables that carry secondary stress are preceded by ",". When giving the transcription of a single word, spaces are generally inserted between syllables (often omitted before syllables that have stress marks). When giving the transcription of a multi-word utterance, it is common to put spaces between words and omit them between syllables.
/@/:
schwa (upside-down 'e').
Used in both unaccented ('bnan', 'cllide', 'but'), and accented ('hmdrm', 'abt') contexts.
The IPA symbol is a schwa.
(British speakers often have different vowels in these two contexts. The accented one is further back and is written /V/. Its IPA symbol is a 'wedge' or upside-down 'v'.)
/l-/, /n-/, /m-/, /N-/:
Superscript schwa preceding consonant.
As in 'batt', 'mitt', 'eat'. Signifies that the consonant is pronounced as a syllable by itself.
The IPA symbol is a vertical bar below the consonant.

/R/:
shwa followed by 'r'.
'opation', 'fth', 'g'.
The IPA symbol is a schwa with a hook.
/&/:
short a.
'mt', 'mp', 'md', 'gg, 'snp', 'ptch'. The IPA symbol is an 'a-e' digraph.
/eI/:
long a ('a' with bar above).
'd', 'fde', 'dte', 'orta', 'drpe', 'cpe'. /A/:
a with diaeresis (two dots) above.
'bther', 'ct', and, with most American speakers, 'fther', 'crt'.
The IPA symbol is a script 'a'.
/a/:
a with dot above.
'fther' as pronounced by speakers who do not rhyme it with bother. /AU/:
a followed by u with dot.
'n', 'ld', 't'.
/b/:
'ay', 'ri'.
/tS/:
ch. The dictionary notes "(actually, this sound is \ + \sh\)" 'in', 'nare' (/'neI tSR/). In IPA transcription, this is sometimes spelled as 'c with hacek'.
/d/:
'i', 'aer'.
/E/:
short e.
'bt', 'bd', 'pck'.
The IPA symbol is a lower-case epsilon. It is sometimes spelled with a small capital E.
/i/:
long e ('e' with bar above).
'bt', 'nosebld', 'venl', 's'. /f/:
'ity', 'cu'
/g/:
'o', 'bi', 'ift'.
/h/:
'at', 'aead'.
/hw/:
'ale' as pronounced by those who do not have the same pronunciation for both 'whale' and 'wail'.
/I/:
short i.
'tp', 'bansh', 'actve'.
The IPA symbol is a small capital I or a lower-case iota.

/aI/:
long i ('i' with bar above).
'ste', 'sde', 'b', 'trpe'.
/dZ/:
j. The dictionary notes "(actually, this sound is \d\ + \zh\)" 'ob', 'em', 'e', 'oin', 'uin', 'oo', 'a'.
/x/:
k with bar below. (Same as /C/.)
German 'Bu'.
/C/:
k with bar below. (Same as /x/.)
German 'i'.
/l/:
'iy', 'poo'.
/m/:
'urur', 'di', 'nyph'.
/n/:
'o', 'ow'.
/~/:
superscript 'n'.
"indicates that a preceeding vowel or diphthong is pronounced with the nasal passages open as in French 'un bon vin blanc' /W~ bo~ va~ blA~/" The IPA diacritic is a tilde above the vowel.
/N/:
eng ('n' with a tail).
'si' /sIN/, 'sier' /'sIN R/, 'fier' /'fIN gR/, 'ik' /iNk/ The IPA symbol is an eng.
/oU/:
long o ('o' with bar above).
'bne', 'kn', 'b'.
/O/:
'o' with dot above.
's', 'll', 'gn'.
The IPA symbol is a small open 'o' or upside-down 'c'.

/W/:
o-e digraph
French 'bf', german 'Hlle.
The IPA symbol is an o-e digraph.
/Oi/:
'o' with dot above followed by 'i'.
'cn', 'destr'. (The dictionary also lists 'sng', but I pronounce that as two separate syllables /'sO IN/.) /p/:
'eer', 'li'.
/r/:
'ed', 'ca', 'aity'.
/s/:
'our', 'le'.
/S/:
sh.
'y', 'mion', 'maine', 'speal'.
The IPA symbol is an esh: a tall, pulled 's' or long, barless 'f'.

/t/:
'ie', 'aack'.
/T/:
th.
'in'. 'eer'.
The IPA symbol as a lower-case theta.
/D/:
'th' with bar below.
'en', 'eier', 'is'.
The IPA symbol is an eth, sort of a script 'd' with the bar crossed.

/u/:
'u' with diaeresis (two dots) above.
'rle', 'yth', 'union' /'jun j@n/, 'few' /fju/. /U/:
'u' with dot above.
'pll', 'wd', 'bk', 'curable' /'kjUr @ b@l/. The IPA symbol is a small letter upsilon. A small capital U or closed lower-case omega is also used.
/y/:
u-e digraph.
German 'fllen', 'hbsch', French 'r'.
/v/:
'iid', 'gi'.
/w/:
'e', 'aay'.
/j/:
'ard', 'oung', 'cue' /kju/, 'union' /'jun y@n/;

/;/:
superscript 'y' following consonant;
"indicates that during the articulation of the sound represented by the preceding character, the front of the tongue has substantially the position it has for the articulation of the first sound of 'yard', as in French 'digne' /din;/."
The IPA diacritic is a superscript 'j' following or hook below the consonant.
/ju/:
'th', 'nion', 'c', 'f', 'mte'.
/jU/:
'crable', 'fry'.
/z/:
'one', 'rai'.
/Z/:
zh.
'vion', 'azure' /'aZ R/.
The IPA symbol is a yogh: like a flat-topped '3' lowered so that the top is the height of that of a 'z'.
#end quote
(!!)

Usenet · Answer

Bill Bonde ( ''Stop this farce!'' ''Which one?'' ) > misc.education.language.english
in
[nq:1]It is expected that when the Unicode/ISO 10646 character set becomes commonly used for mail, news, and web pages, this transcription will no longer be needed, as the IPA characters will be able to be used directly.[/nq]
Just what's happening today

Nowadays we can have perfectly working Unicode readers, where the IPA standard symbols are fully supported.
Moreover, alternative 7bit symbols like
[nq:1]/&/: short a. 'mt', 'mp', 'md', 'gg, 'snp', 'ptch'. The IPA symbol is an 'a-e' digraph.[/nq]
are not universally recognized as IPA.
The alternative symbols might even cause some confusion, in my view, as they are used in a different way in other phonetic conventions such as Merriam Webster's pronunciation guide, where for instance the & stands for the schwa sound.
http://merriam-webster.com/help/pronguide.htm

Enrico C
www.40tude.com/dialog - Mail: www.ritlabs.com/the bat Local News/Mail Server: http://tglsoft.de/misc/hamster en.htm

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