payment is expected from

Question

Would you let me know whether the following sentences are right or wrong, and explain why?

#1. The company’s third loan payment is expected from ABC Bank on Friday. (O/X)
#2. He expects the company’s third loan payment from ABC Bank on Friday. (O/X)
#3. The third loan payment is expected from the company on Friday. (O/X)
#4. He expects the third loan payment from the company on Friday. (O/X)

Thanks in advance.

Clive · Accepted Answer

They are all correct grammar.

Here are a few comments on meaning and vocabulary.

I assume you realize that your sentences do not all have the same meaning.
eg some mention a bank, and some do not.

Are you talking about lending money or about repaying money?
When repaying a loan, we commonly speak of a loan 'repayment'.
If repayment is done eg over a period of months, we speak of each payment as an 'installment'.

We sometimes say 'ABC Bank',and sometimes 'the XYZ Bank'.

Niue · Answer

Thanks, Clive.

However, I have a different opinion:

I think #2 is ILLOGICAL, and #2 and #1 have the same meaning, thus #1 and #2 are WRONG.

The one who repays the loan is the company, NOT ABC Bank!

Therefore, "#4. He expects the third loan payment from the company on Friday." is RIGHT but "#2. He expects the company’s third loan payment from ABC Bank on Friday." is WRONG.

What do you think? Would you let me know what I'm missing? Please, help me~

Clive · Answer

Payments relating to a loan can be either the lender (the bank) giving the money to the borrower, or the borrower repaying the money to the lender.
You did not make clear which case you were talking about. That's what I tried to explain in my last post.

In other words,you need to begin by providing some context for your sentences.
eg The ABC Company has borrowed money from the XYZ bank. ABC is now repaying this money to XYZ by a series of monthly installments.
Is this the situation you are talking about?

In #1 and #3, who is doing the expecting? The bank? Or the company?

In #2 and #4, who is 'he'? eg The bank president? eg The company president?

Niue · Answer

Payments relating to a loan can be either the lender (the bank) giving the money to the borrower, or the borrower repaying the money to the lender. You did not make clear which case you were talking about. That's what I tried to explain in my last post.
In other words,you need to begin by providing some context for your sentences. eg The ABC Company has borrowed money from the XYZ bank. ABC is now repaying this money to XYZ by a series of monthly installments. Is this the situation you are talking about?
Yes.

In #1 and #3, who is doing the expecting? The bank? Or the company?
A person who does not belong to the bank nor the company.

In #2 and #4, who is 'he'? eg The bank president? eg The company president?
A person who does not belong to the bank nor the company.

Niue · Answer

Do you mean the following? :

In #1, if the bank is expecting, #1 is WRONG, but if the company is expecting, #1 is CORRECT.
In #3, if the company is expecting, #3 is WRONG, but if the bank is expecting, #3 is CORRECT.

In #2, if 'he' is the bank president, #2 is WRONG, but if 'he' is the company president, #2 is CORRECT.
In #4, if 'he' is the company president, #4 is WRONG, but if 'he' is the bank president, #4 is CORRECT.

Clive · Answer

#1. The company’s third loan payment is expected from ABC Bank on Friday. (O/X)\
Wrong. Sounds like the bank is supposed to pay the company. Perhaps you mean 'expected by the bank', which means the company is supposed to pay the bank.

#2. He expects the company’s third loan payment from ABC Bank on Friday. (O/X)
Wrong, for the same reason as #1 is wrong.

#3. The third loan payment is expected from the company on Friday. (O/X) Right.
This means the company is supposed to pay.

#4. He expects the third loan payment from the company on Friday. (O/X) Right.

This means the company is supposed to pay.

I think perhaps you may not understand 'expect from'.

Niue · Answer

Thanks, Clive.
Let me post the final question.

Originally, I wanted to ask you the following question in an official TOEIC test:

"The company's third loan ( ) is expected from ABC Bank on Tuesday.

A. pays
B. paid
C. payable
D. payment

(There is NO context. There are JUST the above single sentence and the four choices.)"

If you put 'payable' into the blank, the sentence can be paraphrased as this:

The company's third loan payable is expected from ABC Bank on Tuesday.
= He expects the company's third loan payable from ABC Bank on Tuesday.
= He expects the company's third remaining balance on the loan from ABC Bank on Tuesday. (NOT CLEAR)

Whoever he is, this sentence does NOT have a clear meaning.
Thus, 'payable' is not the appropriate word for the sentence.

(I referred to the following:

"If any portion of the loan is still payable as of the date of a company's balance sheet, the remaining balance on the loan is called a loan payable. ((http://www.accountingtools.com/loan-payable))")

However, I don't think 'payment' is the correct answer, either:

The company's third loan payment is expected from ABC Bank on Tuesday.
= He expects the company's third loan payment from ABC Bank on Tuesday. (WRONG)

Whoever he is, the company repays the loan, NOT ABC Bank!

Therefore, I think the original TOEIC question is very poor question, which causes a lot of controversy.

If the orginal sentence were "The company's third loan ( ) is expected by ABC Bank on Tuesday.", then the answer would be 'payment', undoubtedly.

What do you think? Do you agree with me?
Thanks in advance.

Niue · Answer

I revised my qustion:

Do you mean the following? :

In #1, if the bank is expecting, #1 is CORRECT, because the sentence can be understood as this:
From ABC Bank, the company’s third loan payment is expected. =
By ABC Bank, the company’s third loan payment is expected.

In #2, if 'he' is the bank president, #2 is CORRECT, because the sentence can be understood as this:
From ABC Bank, the bank president expects the company’s third loan payment.

In #3, if the company is expecting, #3 is CORRECT, because the sentence can be understood as this:
The third loan payment is expected by the company on Friday.

In #4, if 'he' is the company president, #4 is CORRECT, because the sentence can be understood as this:
From the company, the companyy president expects the third loan payment.

Thanks in advance.

Clive · Answer

If you want to repeat my words and add your comments, please put your comments in a different colour. If you don't, it becomes almost impossible for me to understand the post.:

Do you mean the following? :

In #1, if the bank is expecting, #1 is CORRECT, because the sentence can be understood as this:
From ABC Bank, the company’s third loan payment is expected. =
By ABC Bank, the company’s third loan payment is expected.
No. 'From' is not the same as 'by'. You seem to have trouble understanding this.

In addition, you told me that the person doing the expecting was A person who does not belong to the bank nor the company.

I'm not even going to look at your comments about #3 and #4, because you told me that the person doing the expecting was A person who does not belong to the bank nor the company. Now you are saying something different.

In #2, if 'he' is the bank president, #2 is CORRECT, because the sentence can be understood as this:
From ABC Bank, the bank president expects the company’s third loan payment. I have the same comment as for #1.

I'm not even going to look at your comments about #3 and #4, because, as I said above, you told me that the person doing the expecting was A person who does not belong to the bank nor the company. Now you are saying something different.

____________________________

This thread is getting very long and hard for me to follow, and we are saying everything 4 times.
If you want to discuss this further, I'd like to create one simple example, in a fixed context. After we discuss that, we can go on to another one. Do you want me to do this? Or not? It's your decision.

Clive

Clive · Answer

I didn't realize you had posted two consecutive replies. Let me now answer this one.

I wish you had shown me this test question in the first place, instead of the 4 sentences you asked about. We could have saved ourselves a lot of effort.

Originally, I wanted to ask you the following question in an official TOEIC test:

"The company's third loan ( ) is expected from ABC Bank on Tuesday.

A. pays
B. paid
C. payable
D. payment

(There is NO context. There are JUST the above single sentence and the four choices.)"

If you put 'payable' into the blank, the sentence can be paraphrased as this:

The company's third loan payable is expected from ABC Bank on Tuesday.
= He expects the company's third loan payable from ABC Bank on Tuesday.
= He expects the company's third remaining balance on the loan from ABC Bank on Tuesday. (NOT CLEAR)

Whoever he is, this sentence does NOT have a clear meaning.
Thus, 'payable' is not the appropriate word for the sentence. Correct, it's not.

(I referred to the following:

"If any portion of the loan is still payable as of the date of a company's balance sheet, the remaining balance on the loan is called a loan payable. ((http://www.accountingtools.com/loan-payable ))")

However, I don't think 'payment' is the correct answer, either:

The company's third loan payment is expected from ABC Bank on Tuesday.
= He expects the company's third loan payment from ABC Bank on Tuesday. (WRONG)

Whoever he is, the company repays the loan, NOT ABC Bank!

Therefore, I think the original TOEIC question is very poor question, which causes a lot of controversy.

If the orginal sentence were "The company's third loan ( ) is expected by ABC Bank on Tuesday.", then the answer would be 'payment', undoubtedly.

What do you think? Do you agree with me? The original question is in error. It should be BY, not FROM.
The correct and expected answer is obviously 'payment'.

payment is expected from

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