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Hela Posted 21 years ago
Grammar

Past form of the verbs "lie / lay"

0 Dear teachers, 02br
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00Would you please explain to me the choice of the tense (simple past) of the verb to LIE (?) in the following text? 02br
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00We scraped at the earth at the base of the frame and came upon others bones, they 01b001 were laid out02b00 (01u00past form of LAY OUT02u00 ?) in a pattern that twisted in under the frame posts, and after a while Chris said, “I think it's a man. Maybe the miners buried people alive under their buildings for luck, like the Melanesians.” But the skeleton was too large to be human, the bones of the legs were exceptionally long and as we uncovered more of it, we could see that the creature had a thin, curved neck like a swan, but much longer and more powerful. Then I said, “It's a moa.” We both stopped digging and sat back from the skeleton. “We shouldn't move it,” I said and Chris said, “But who is there to show it to ?” We sat and looked at the bones for a while, a little afraid aware that the great bird had remained undisturbed for a thousand years. Then Chris said that we should collect the bones and take them to the house where we could piece the skeleton together again, it would be safer there though safer against what he did not say. 02br
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00In the days that followed we 01b002 laid out02b00 (01u00past form of LAY OUT02u00 ?) the bones in a shed beside the house and began to fit them together. I had made a sketch of how they 01b003 lay02b00 (01u00simple past of LIE ? If yes, why not the past perfect02u00 ?) and Chris had glued a piece of paper to each bone and numbered it according to my drawing the way we imagined scientists did. Because the skeleton had been twisted where it 01b004 lay02b00 (01u00simple past of LIE02u00 ?) in the earth our attempt to arrange it in its true shape was based partly on how we imagined the bird must once have looked. We worked on the moa late into the evenings the two of us crouched in the shed under an oil lamp with the bones scattered around us arranging adjusting, fitting and matching the pieces we had taken from the earth, until we were light-headed with the effort of it, and still the great bird 01b005 lay02b00 (01u00simple past of LIE02u00 ?) stubbornly misshapen on the floor, less clear now in its form than when we had uncovered it first at the head of the valley. 02br
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00Thank you for your help. 02br
00Hela 0-
  

Top answer

0 Hello Hella 02br 02br 00I agree with you in every lie/lay matter. 02br 00 intransitive : LIE - LAY - LAIN 02br 00 transitive : LAY - LAID - LAID 02br 00[1] They 01b 00were laid out02b 00 (passive/past form of LAY OUT) 02br 00[2] We 01b 00laid out02b 00 the bone (active/past form of LAY OUT) 02br 00[3] how they 01b 00lay02b 00 (active/past of LIE) 02br 00[4] where it 01b 00lay02b 00 in (active/past of LIE) 02br 00[5] the bird 01b 00lay02b 00 mis-shapen on the floor. (active/past of LIE) 02br 00 Here "mis-shapen" is working as a 'subject-oriented adjunctive adejective'.

  • 0 Hello Hella 02br 02br 00I agree with you in every lie/lay matter.
  • 02br 00 intransitive : LIE - LAY - LAIN 02br 00 transitive : LAY - LAID - LAID 02br 00[1] They 01b 00were laid out02b 00 (passive/past form of LAY OUT) 02br 00[2] We 01b 00laid out02b 00 the bone (active/past form of LAY OUT) 02br 00[3] how they 01b 00lay02b 00 (active/past of LIE) 02br 00[4] where it 01b 00lay02b 00 in (active/past of LIE) 02br 00[5] the bird 01b 00lay02b 00 mis-shapen on the floor.
  • (active/past of LIE) 02br 00 Here "mis-shapen" is working as a 'subject-oriented adjunctive adejective'.
  • 02br 02br 00As for your question about the tense of [3], I don't understand rather why the author used the past perfect tense for the main clauses.
  • If I were the author I would write "I made a sketch" instead of "I had made a sketch".
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7 Answers
0
0 Hello Hella 02br
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00I agree with you in every lie/lay matter. 02br
00 intransitive : LIE - LAY - LAIN 02br
00 transitive : LAY - LAID - LAID 02br
00[1] They 01b00were laid out02b00 (passive/past form of LAY OUT) 02br
00[2] We 01b00laid out02b00 the bone (active/past
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0 01blockquote
00...simple past of LIE ? If yes, why not the past perfect?...12blockquote
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00'Sketching how they lay' preceded 'beginning to fit them together', so 'I had made a sketch' is past perfect. 02br
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00However, by the time we reach 'how they lay', the temporal relationship has already been established, so there'
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0Thank you both for your help, and thank you MrP for not forgetting me about the texts...05002br
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00Now, how would you both analyse the sentence "The great bird lay stubbornly misshapen on the floor" ? 02br
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00The great bird = subject 02br
00lay = intransitive verb 02br
00stubbornly misshapen = subject complement ? / ad
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0 Hello Hela 02br
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00I parse the sentence in question as; 02br
0100The great bird lay stubbornly on the floor, though it was ill-shaped.02br
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00By the way, why did you take "on the floor" as a time adverbial? It's a place adverbial. 02br
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00paco 0-
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0Of course, Paco, you're right. "Où avais-je la tête?!" 05002br
00How would you translate that sentence, MrP? 02br
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00Cheers 010id38
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0 Perhaps: 02br
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00'What's wrong with me today?' 02br
00'What(ever) was I thinking of?' 02br
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00Or even a simple Simpsonic: 02br
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00'Doh!' 02br
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00I would read our misshapen bird slightly differently: it's 'stubbornly misshapen' because it resists all attempts to lay it out correctly. 02
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0 Hello Monsieur P 02br
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00I should agree. Your interpretaion is much more reasonable. 02br
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00paco 0-

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