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Question

What's the difference between these phrases.

1) i found a program which tried to introduce healty foods.

2) i found a program trying to introduce healty foods.

3)i found a program try to introduce healty cooks. ( i know this sounds ackward but isn't it similar to " i saw him talk" or "it makes me beg".) i am very confused with these tenses.

on top of, i am also confused with the use of 'ing' and 'ed' after noun. is it known as modifiers? ( i don't know much about the specific grammar terms )but if it is, how do i determine which one of noun does it modify? the preceding noun or the subsequent noun?

eg; 1) my teacher checked my book, demanding major revision.
2) my teacher checked my book, named the haunted.

at ponit no 1, 'demanding' is refered to the subsequent action of the teacher. but at point no 2, 'named' is refered to the name of the book. is it right?

and at point no 2, isn't it similar to " jack wrote a book named the haunted" . wrote is a verb and book is a noun. same goes as "cheked" is a verb and "book" is a noun.

and the last one, i am confused with the verb after noun and pronoun. i see many phrases in movies or stories showing that after the pronoun like "them", "me", "you" is followed by 'ing' and somtimes 'ed' and sometime the root verb.

i am sorry if my words are not clear because i just started learning english about 6 months ago. i started from zero, so i am a pretty much noob. i hope someone could understand this and explain it to me. i am very glad if anyone could even correct my grammar mistakes in my writing.

Mister Micawber · Accepted Answer

Hello, Yusra - and welcome to English Forums.

1) i found a program which tried to introduce healty foods.-- The program no longer exists or no longer tries that.

2) i found a program trying to introduce healty foods.-- The program is operating now.

3)i found a program try to introduce healty cooks. -- This sentence is no good.
( i know this sounds ackward but isn't it similar to " i saw him talk" or "it makes me beg".-- The structure is similar but the verbs are different. Your first example is from a set of sense verbs (see, hear, feel) and your second example is from the set of causative verbs (make, let, have, get)

on top of, i am also confused with the use of 'ing' and 'ed' after noun. is it known as modifiers? ( i don't know much about the specific grammar terms )but if it is, how do i determine which one of noun does it modify? the preceding noun or the subsequent noun?-- Almost always the subsequent noun: a demanding task, a named associate.

eg; 1) my teacher checked my book, demanding major revision.-- 'Demanding' is a nonfinite verb here, not a noun modifier.

2) my teacher checked my book, named The Haunted.- The whole clause ('named The Haunted') modifies 'book', but 'named' is again a nonfinite verb, not an adjective.

at ponit no 1, 'demanding' is refered to the subsequent action of the teacher. but at point no 2, 'named' is refered to the name of the book. is it right?-- 'Revision' is the object of the verb 'demand'; 'The Haunted' is the object of the verb 'named'.

and the last one, i am confused with the verb after noun and pronoun. i see many phrases in movies or stories showing that after the pronoun like "them", "me", "you" is followed by 'ing' and somtimes 'ed' and sometime the root verb.-- Please give us examples of sentences that worry you.

Yusra Hashim · Answer

thank *** someone has replied. i am so glad. thank you very much Mister Micawber .

i think i got your explanations at point no 1 and 2 but still have dificulty to understand about the sense verbs and causative verbs and also about nonfinitive verbs. maybe it is too advance for me.

here some examples that you asked before.

1) Have them send the troops there.
2) have them sending the troops. (its the same as "to have them talking" right?)
3) have them dressed up.
4)i see you laughing. ( why don't we say " i see you are laughing"?)
5) do you see me laughing.

actually i don't have a teacher teaching me english, i learn it by myself through reading and listening. so i don't really know about the gramar terms for certain tenses.

so i am glad if you could advice me what topic shoud i practice regarding to my confusion so that i can google it and practice it. thank you

Yusra Hashim · Answer

i forgot, there is another one.

at point number 1

1) i found a program trying to introduce healthy foods.

2) i spent 2 years at university finishing my thesis.

i noticed that "trying at point number 1 is refered to the program. but at the point number 2 "finishing" is refered to me spending 2 years finishing my thesis. this really confuses me. why at point number 1"finishing" is refered to the second noun but at point number 2 it s refered to "i" which is the first pronoun?

is there any simple rule that easy to understand about this?

Mister Micawber · Answer

Well, first: the pronoun and the causative verb is irrelevant; these -ing and -ed forms appear in many different structures.

1) Have them/John send the troops there. = 'Send' is a single action here

2) Have them/John sending the troops. (its the same as "to have them talking" right?-- Yes)- 'Send' is an ongoing action here.

3) have them/John dressed up.--'Dress' is a completed action here.

4)I see you/John laughing.-- 'Laugh' is an ongoing action here. ( why don't we say " i see you are laughing"?- You can say that, too.)
5) do you see me/John laughing? As #4

actually i don't have a teacher teaching me english, i learn it by myself through reading and listening. so i don't really know about the gramar terms for certain tenses.so i am glad if you could advice me what topic shoud i practice regarding to my confusion so that i can google it and practice it. thank you. --You will need to learn grammar terms if you want to google explanations for them. In this thread, we have talked about present participles, past participles, non-finite verbs, non-finite clauses, and causative verbs. You can google all those phrases and read about them. Be sure to bookmark the sites you like.

1) i found a program trying to introduce healthy foods.
2) i spent 2 years at university finishing my thesis.

i noticed that "trying at point number 1 is refered to the program. but at the point number 2 "finishing" is refered to me spending 2 years finishing my thesis. this really confuses me. why at point number 1"finishing" is refered to the second noun but at point number 2 it s refered to "i" which is the first pronoun?-- Because English grammar structure permits those word orders and relies on the reader's common sense to understand who is trying and who is finishing.

is there any simple rule that easy to understand about this?-- None that I know of. The guidelines make it clear, however, that you cannot organize your sentence like that if there is indeed confusion about which is the subject of the nonfinite verb.

Yusra Hashim · Answer

actually i don't know how i do that. i just write and i am not sure whether its correct or not. maybe because i listen and read too much on articles so it just happens automatically. but when i analyze the structure, i will become confused. however, thank you very much mister. it really helps me clear some of my confusion. i will do the practices on the topics that you mentioned. thanks again!

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