Is there a reason behind that?

Question

0From time to time I hear teachers of english say that " There is no need to use the passive form of the Perfect Progressive Tenses" Sometimes I wanted to know why but nobody answered me. will you gently answer me if there is a logical reason.02br00thanks in advance02br00Ayman 0-

Avangi · Accepted Answer

0Hi Ayman, just wingin' it on this one. 01b01u00WELCOME TO THE FORUMS ! !02u02b02br
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00It looks to me that transforming the present perfect progressive from active voice to passive voice comes out with the same result as doing it to the present perfect. That is, the progressive aspect of it seems to get lost in the process.02br
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01i00He has been stealing light bulbs from the company for years.02i00 (present perfect progressive - active voice)02br
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01i00Light bulbs have been stolen by him from the company for years.02i00 (passive transformation)02br
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01i00He has stolen light bulbs from the company for years.02i00 (present perfect - active voice)02br
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01i00Light bulbs have been stolen by him from the company for years.02i00 (passive transformation) Same thing. I don't see any way to preserve the "progressive" nature of the tense.02br
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00Best wishes, - A. 02br
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00P.S. Was that gentle enough? I just hope I'm right!0-

Emmoo10 · Answer

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01b01u01i01font00I woul like to thank you Avangi because you answer was really persuading and it is the first time to recieve an answer to the question which I have been asking for years. Thanks again02font02i02u02b02h2

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01b**01u01i01font00Ayman 02font02i02u02b**02h2

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BarbaraPA · Answer

0PS - Avangi will kick himself when he realizes he forgot to say this, but welcome to the forums.02br
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00Also, think how awkward the form would be:02br
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00Lightbulbs have been being stolen. Ugh.02br
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00If you want, I can make up a story so that it would fit, but only if you want to emphasize a duration of something in the past AND not name the person doing it would you use this form. 0-

CalifJim · Answer

0 01blockquote

01cite10Avangi12cite11i10He has been stealing light bulbs from the company for years.12i10 (present perfect progressive - active voice)12br
12br
11i10Light bulbs have been stolen by him from the company for years.12i10 (passive transformation)12br
12blockquote

10 Not quite.02br
01i00Light bulbs have been being stolen ...02i00, as GG says. 02br
00It's a bit awkward, so it's not used much, but there is no rule against it, and you will occasionally encounter it.02br
01i00We've been being bitten by mosquitoes all summer long.02i02br
01i00English has been being spoken more and more throughout the world since World War II.02i02br
02br
01i00People have been being laid off every month for two years, and management has still not completed its downsizing.02i02br
00CJ 0-

Clive · Answer

0Hi,02br
02br
01font00It looks to me that transforming the present perfect progressive from active voice to passive voice comes out with the same result as doing it to the present perfect. That is, the progressive aspect of it seems to get lost in the process.02font02br
02br
01font01i00He has been stealing light bulbs from the company for years.02i00 (present perfect progressive - active voice)02font02br
02br
01font01i00Light bulbs have been stolen by him from the company for years.02i00 (passive transformation)02font02br
02br
00Actually, you can say '01i00Light bulbs have been being stolen by him from the company for years'.02i00 However, such continuous passive forms are less common. As you can see, they tend to be rather long and awkkward.02br
02br
00Best wishes, Clive0-

Avangi · Answer

0Thanks Jim. Someone posted on another site, "Is there a sentence anywhere in the world with the combination 01i00have been being02i00?" I was feeling about the same, but there are 367,000 hits with "has" and another 123,000 with "have." Granted, many are grammar sites, but many are not. a 14 year old girl wrote, "I have been being very moody lately." Some guy wrote, "I have been being chased by black entities." Another, "Someone has been being really really mean." If you let these sink in a while, they almost start to sound natural.02br
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00How do I break the news to my poor questioner?02br
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00Best wishes, - A.02br
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00Edit. Thanks also to GG and Clive.02br
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00Edit. Edit. I just realized that only the black entity example is really passive.0-

CalifJim · Answer

0 01blockquote

01cite10Avangi12cite10I just realized that only the black entity example is really passive.12blockquote

10 True, but if you keep hunting on Google, you'll find a lot more that are really passive.02br
00CJ 0-

Avangi · Answer

AvangiThanks Jim. Someone posted on another site, "Is there a sentence anywhere in the world with the combination have been being?" I was feeling about the same, but there are 367,000 hits with "has" and another 123,000 with "have." Granted, many are grammar sites, but many are not. a 14 year old girl wrote, "I have been being very moody lately." Some guy wrote, "I have been being chased by black entities." Another, "Someone has been being really really mean." If you let these sink in a while, they almost start to sound natural.

CalifJim
AvangiI just realized that only the black entity example is really passive.
True, but if you keep hunting on Google, you'll find a lot more that are really passive. CJ

In resurrecting this I discovered there are 115 hits for "been being" on our EF search engine. I'm sure I never heard it growing up in New England.

Nevertheless, I feel duty-bound to report that I heard it last night ad libitum from a caller on a radio talk show. I couldn't believe it. This has already been being done. Has anyone come across anything like this, other than in a grammar book?

Another one I never heard in New England, but heard as an adult in the midwest: "If I would have known you were coming, I would have baked a cake." In that area it seemed to be the preferred version - by well-spoken people! Is it actually correct??

- A.

Tanit · Answer

AvangiAnother one I never heard in New England, but heard as an adult in the midwest: "If I would have known you were coming, I would have baked a cake." In that area it seemed to be the preferred version - by well-spoken people! Is it actually correct??

Hi,

Who am I to say it's incorrect? All that I know is that we (students) are taught not to use it. Never!

However, I remember reading some shocking (to me, poor learner) news here:

They say that "If I'd have known" is used both in the UK and in some parts of the USA, but in the UK " 'd" stands for had and in the USA for would, pretty much as in the sentence you posted.
Some references in Kooyeen's posts.

You native guys make life difficult for us...

Avangi · Answer

Thanks, Tanit.  Your news about the USA is shocking to me too.   - A.

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Is there a reason behind that?

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01b01u01i01font00I woul like to thank you Avangi because you answer was really persuading and it is the first time to recieve an answer to the question which I have been asking for years. Thanks again02font02i02u02b02h2

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