Ironic or sarcastic

Question

Hi,What's the difference between ironic (irony) and sarcastic (sarcasm)?For example in these sentences, can I use both?"Thank you, Sam," she said with heavy irony. In fact, Sam had hardly helped at all."I've broken your CD.""Oh, that's just great." was her sarcastic reply.Thanks,Virginia

Elanguest · Accepted Answer

This might help: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Irony#Verbal_irony_and_sarcasm

Ozzourti · Answer

To me, "sarcasm" is something you say in order to hurt someone. One can employ irony to deliver a sarcastic remark. If nothing is said, there can be no sarcasm.

We usually talk about "irony" when something (happens that) is the exact opposite of what is expected ('situational irony', to be specific), or for instance when you're trying to prevent something bad from happening to you and in doing so you actually make it happen. Getting soaked to the skin with a waterproof raincoat on would be ironic, since it failed to do the job it was specifically designed for.

One of the other definitions of http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/irony is:
the use of words to express something other than and especially the opposite of the literal meaning

It seems that "Thank you, Sam" falls under that category, seeing as the speaker wasn't grateful at all. However, that's a different kind of irony.

Several good examples of what irony is not can be found, ironically, in the lyrics of the song "Ironic" by Alanis Morissette:

It's a black fly in your Chardonnay -- does not express the opposite of what is said, neither does it involve a reversal of what is expected
It's like rain on your wedding day -- OK, where's the irony?

Anyway, to sum up, you often don't even need to say anything for something to be considered 'ironic' -- but when you use irony to deliver a cutting remark, the two terms seem to begin to overlap. I, for one, am very careful about using the word 'irony' in contexts in which not everybody can see it.

Philip · Answer

I once heard a teacher trying to explain the difference to a very young student: Irony is Mother Nature's way of being sarcastic. Not perfect, but it helps. She also explained the difference between two mental conditions: A psychotic thinks that 2+2=5; a neurotic thinks that 2+2=4, but he's awfully unhappy about it.

Virginia274 · Answer

Thanks a lot 	Elanguest, ozzourti and Philip for all your helpful replies.

Perfect Stranger · Answer

I was just about to post the same question! Thanks Virginia for starting this thread and thanks to you guys for answering it! Would you call this remark sarcastic or ironic:Looks like you are a lady killer! Nah, I'm a lady/men/granny/whoever killer <img class='emoticon' style='Width:19px;Height:19px;' data-delaysrc='https://uat-englishforward-forums-backend.s3.us-west-2.amazonaws.com/Emoticons/5.gif' src='https://uat-englishforward-forums-backend.s3.us-west-2.amazonaws.com/Emoticons/5.gif' alt='Emotion: wink'/>

Virginia274 · Answer

Perfect StrangerLooks like you are a lady killer! Nah, I'm a lady/men/granny/whoever killer

One of your options is "Looks like you are a lady killer! Nah, I'm a lady killer." That makes no sense. Did you mean "Nah, I'm not a lady-killer" ?

Please explain in more detail what you are trying to say.

Ozzourti · Answer

Perfect StrangerI was just about to post the same question! Thanks Virginia for starting this thread and thanks to you guys for answering it! Would you call this remark sarcastic or ironic:Looks like you are a lady killer! Nah, I'm a lady/men/granny/whoever killer

A "lady-killer" is a term for a man who is presumably attractive and gets all the girls, apart from the literal meaning of course.

A "granny killer" wouldn't mean anything to me except a person who literally kills grannies or perhaps indirecly causes them to die.

What did you intend to say?

Perfect Stranger · Answer

You see? That's what I understand as sarcasm... Someone calls a guy a lady-killer and because he doesn't consider himself as a lady-killer he says Nah, I'm a granny-killer which means he can't really get any girls...

Virginia274 · Answer

Since "granny-killer" is not a idiom, I might wonder if he misunderstood and thought you asked if he was a person who murders ladies. He replies that he only kills old ladies.

(Grandmothers are ladies.)
Anyway, the joke would be "I'm not a lady-killer; the only women who will pay attention to me are old women (grannies)."

Ozzourti · Answer

Perfect StrangerYou see? That's what I understand as sarcasm... Someone calls a guy a lady-killer and because he doesn't consider himself as a lady-killer he says Nah, I'm a granny-killer which means he can't really get any girls...

I was confused because in your previous post you wrote "Looks like you are a lady killer! Nah, I'm a lady/men/granny/whoever killer", as if the speaker negated it at first but then went on to say "I am a lady killer". That's why I asked what you really meant by a 'lady/granny/whatever killer'.

Looks like you are a lady-killer! Nah, I'm a granny-killer. makes more sense but is still a poor example of sarcasm when you're the **** of the joke. Sarcastic remarks are usually directed at people other than you, but calling yourself a 'granny killer' as opposed to a 'lady killer', you actually hurt yourself and no harm is done to others. Perhaps it verges on irony, provided that you in fact consider yourself a lady-killer and a 'granny-killer' is seen as the opposite of the former. Maybe if you were proud of being a lady-killer and were constantly bragging about it, then someone might cut you down saying: "Yeah, sure. You're a granny-killer at best.". That would be sarcasm.

Ironic or sarcastic

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