I want to decide about the concept of 'as' relative pronoun.

Question

I will decide to forget the concept of 'as' as a relative pronoun because it cause the only confusion, and I will treat such usages as 'as' relative pronoun as a conjunction or preposition.

So I will interpret like the followings from now on:
1) Don't lose your passport, as I did (my passport) last year.
2) I'm enclosing my check for $10, as (it was) agreed.
3) He was brave man, as (brave men) are all of his family.
4) Her feet were bare, as (bare foot) was the custom in those days.
5) As we had expected (so ), he did not show up.
6) As (it) is often the case, she is absent.
7) I prefer coffee as (being) opposed to tea.
8) Junior football, as (being) distinguished from senior football, has existed since the early 1880's.

And the ellipses of word(s) in parenthesis would be imperative or optional depending on the structure.
I'd like to know whether my conclusion is proper.
Thank you in advance for your help

GPY · Accepted Answer

2) I'm enclosing my check for $10, as (it was) agreed.

"as we agreed" would probably be more usual.

3) He was a brave man, as (brave men) are all of his family.

This isn't right. To get the right kind of meaning one would have to say "as all of his family are brave men".

4) Her feet were bare, as (bare foot) was the custom in those days.

Should be "as bare feet were the custom" or "as going barefoot was the custom", but these alterations cause "as" to be interpreted as "because", thereby changing the meaning slightly.

5) As we had expected (so ), he did not show up.

Not right with "so".

6) As (it) is often the case, she is absent.

Not right with "it".

7) I prefer coffee as (being) opposed to tea.

Not right with "being". ("as opposed to" is a set expression. You cannot change it.)

8) Junior football, as (being) distinguished from senior football, has existed since the early 1880's.

Unnatural with "being".

Park sang joon · Answer

Thank you, GPY, for your answer

GPY5) As we had expected (so ), he did not show up.Not right with "so".6) As (it) is often the case, she is absent.Not right with "it".7) I prefer coffee as (being) opposed to tea.Not right with "being". ("as opposed to" is a set expression. You cannot change it.)8) Junior football, as (being) distinguished from senior football, has existed since the early 1880's.Unnatural with "being".

5) As we had expected (so ), he did not show up.
I think also 'as' clause need not 'so'
6) As (it) is often the case, she is absent.
I think 'as' can play the role of a subject with a conjunction.
7) I prefer coffee as (being) opposed to tea.
8) Junior football, as (being) distinguished from senior football, has existed since the early 1880's.
I wished that I had shown 'as' was used as a preposition; Are the above sentences #7,8 ungrammatical?

GPY · Answer

park sang joon5) As we had expected (so ), he did not show up.I think also 'as' clause need not 'so'

Sorry, I cannot understand what you mean.

park sang joon6) As (it) is often the case, she is absent.I think 'as' can play the role of a subject with a conjunction.

At the moment I cannot think of any good example of "as + verb ..." where inserting an implied subject after "as" (and leaving everything else alone) is natural and correct English and also leaves the meaning unchanged. (I am happy to be corrected if some do exist.)

park sang joon7) I prefer coffee as (being) opposed to tea.8) Junior football, as (being) distinguished from senior football, has existed since the early 1880's.I wished that I had shown 'as' was used as a preposition; Are the above sentences #7,8 ungrammatical?

With "being" inserted, they are as good as ungrammatical. #7 makes no sense; possibly it sounds as if coffee is opposed to (does not agree with) tea. #8 is intelligible I suppose, but isn't natural English.

Park sang joon · Answer

1. Sorry, I cannot understand what you mean.

2. At the moment I cannot think of any good example of "as + verb ..." where inserting an implied subject after "as" (and leaving everything else alone) is natural and correct English and also leaves the meaning unchanged. (I am happy to be corrected if some do exist

3. With "being" inserted, they are as good as ungrammatical. #7 makes no sense; possibly it sounds as if coffee is opposed to (does not agree with) tea. #8 is intelligible I suppose, but isn't natural English.

1. I meant I think 'so' is unnecessary as you.
2. How about "As the case is (such) often, she is absent."
3. How about the followings :
I prefer coffee as (its being) opposed to tea.
Junior football, as (its being) distinguished from senior football, has existed since the early 1880's.

Fivejedjon · Answer

park sang joon2. How about "As the case is (such) often, she is absent."3. How about the followings :I prefer coffee as (its being) opposed to tea.Junior football, as (its being) distinguished from senior football, has existed since the early 1880's.

These are all unnatural,

Park sang joon · Answer

Thank you, fivejedjon, for your opnion.
I think as #2 and #3 have been used idiomatically this way for a long time, many might feel my interpretation unnatural.

Fivejedjon · Answer

park sang joonI think as #2 and #3 have been used idiomatically this way for a long time, many might feel my interpretation unnatural.

park sang joon, none of these is natural:

2a. As the case is often, she is absent.
2b. As the case is such often, she is absent.
3a. I prefer coffee as opposed to tea.
3b. I prefer coffee as its being opposed to tea.
4a. Junior football, as distinguished from senior football, has existed since the early 1880s.
4b. Junior football, as its being distinguished from senior football, has existed since the early 1880s.

What we'd be more likely to say is:

2. As is often the case, she is absent.
3. I prefer coffee to tea.
4. Junior football, as distinct from senior football, has existed since the early 1880s.

GPY · Answer

fivejedjonpark sang joon, none of these is natural:

Personally I would accept "Junior football, as distinguished from senior football, ...". For the purposes of the thread, I was also accepting "I prefer coffee as opposed to tea", though I agree that in fact you do not need "as opposed" at all, and the sentence is better off without it.

Park sang joon · Answer

Thank both of you for your opinions.

What about "Junior football, as (its being) distinct from senior football, has existed since the early 1880's."?

And the phrases 'as opposed to' and 'as distinguished from' are expressions listed in dictionaries.
What words on earth do you think are omitted in those incomplete 'as' clauses?
I'd like to hear your opinions about that?

Fivejedjon · Answer

park sang joonWhat about "Junior football, as (its being) distinct from senior football, has existed since the early 1880's."?

No,

park sang joonWhat words on earth do you think are omitted in those incomplete 'as' clauses?I'd like to hear your opinions about that?

Stop thinking of the original sentence as 'incomplete;. They are not. Nothing has been omitted.

I want to decide about the concept of 'as' relative pronoun.

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