He walked under (the) birches

Question

Hello teachers. I am describing a man who walked under some birches.
1. He walked under birches.
2. He walked under the birches.
If I am mentioning these birches for the first time, is either one of them incorrect?
I opt for #1 (under birches), because they have not been mentioned before. But I think #2 is OK too (it's the birches that were there), especially if the context makes sense for them to be there (for example, if I am talking about a forest, where one expects birches).
Yes? No? Am I offside?
Thanks
Maggie

Mister Micawber · Accepted Answer

Hello, Maggie—and welcome to English Forums. Thank you for registering as a member.

Maggie FongIf I am mentioning these birches for the first time, is either one of them incorrect?

'The' is not correct in the context you present.

Maggie Fong if the context makes sense for them to be there (for example, if I am talking about a forest, where one expects birches).

You are confusing grammar with reality. The concept of 'context' is grammatical, not notional. The trees must be mentioned in the text if you wish to use 'the'.

Maggie FongAm I offside?

A bit, but that's OK. That's why we referees are here.

Maggie Fong · Answer

Thank you so much for your answer, Mr. Micawber, and for welcoming me.

But what if I were to substitute "birches" with "trees"? "He walked under trees" - that sounds less natural than "under the trees", particularly if one is describing a park/forest.

Maybe I am not expressing myself well. Suppose I am writing about a girl who woke up, opened the window, and listened to (the) birds chirp. The definite article can be used, even if the birds have not been mentioned before - the reader will simply take it to mean as the birds that are there, right? Why/how are birches different?

Mister Micawber · Answer

Maggie FongBut what if I were to substitute "birches" with "trees"? "He walked under trees" - that sounds less natural than "under the trees", particularly if one is describing a park/forest.

If you mention a forest, it by definition includes trees, but it does not by definition include birches. So with 'trees' you can use 'the' if you mention a forest. The same holds true of birds; you can expect birds but you cannot necessarily expect bulbuls.

While we are on the topic, we would probably not use zero article anyway; we would use the plural indefinite 'some':

The girl woke up, opened the window, and listened to some bulbuls singing.
He entered the forest and sat under some birches.

Maggie Fong · Answer

Mister MicawberIf you mention a forest, it by definition includes trees, but it does not by definition include birches. So with 'trees' you can use 'the' if you mention a forest. The same holds true of birds; you can expect birds but you cannot necessarily expect bulbuls.While we are on the topic, we would probably not use zero article anyway; we would use the plural indefinite 'some':The girl woke up, opened the window, and listened to some bulbuls singing.He entered the forest and sat under some birches.

Thank you! This is very helpful! One last relevant question and you're done with me, I promise. Just to summarize, in my second example:
1. The girl woke up, opened the window, and listened to birds singing. Correct, but #2 and #3 are better.
2. The girl woke up, opened the window, and listened to some birds singing. Correct.
3. The girl woke up, opened the window, and listened to the birds singing. Correct as well.

Did I get it?

Maggie Fong · Answer

Oh, and (please don't get upset):

The girl went to the park and walked under the green trees.

That "green" in there . . . I suppose that the definite article is correct, since people expect trees to be green, especially if it's summer.

And that is my final question.

Mister Micawber · Answer

Maggie Fong1. The girl woke up, opened the window, and listened to birds singing. Correct, but #2 and #3 are better.2. The girl woke up, opened the window, and listened to some birds singing. Correct.3. The girl woke up, opened the window, and listened to the birds singing. Correct as well.Did I get it?

Those all seem fine to me, yes.

Mister Micawber · Answer

Maggie FongThe girl went to the park and walked under the green trees.That "green" in there . . . I suppose that the definite article is correct, since people expect trees to be green, especially if it's summer.

Yes, right.

Maggie Fong · Answer

Thank you so much for your help and patience, Mister Micawber!

He walked under (the) birches

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