Grammar question no. 66: tomatoes and cut tomatoes?

Question

Hello there,Let's say we're making a salad and we cut some tomatoes... We suddenly realize that we've cut one too many of them. Do we say:We've got too many tomatoes.orWe've got too much tomatoes.I'm sure it's the first one but for some reason it sounds awkward to me...Thanks

Philip · Accepted Answer

My inclination is "too much tomato", as I see the items as non-countable once they've been cut.

CalifJim · Answer

Perfect StrangerWe've got too many tomatoes. ... for some reason it sounds awkward to me

Keep saying it again and again and it will start to sound right.

Short story, you can't have "much" with a plural.

CJ

Grammarfreak · Answer

CalifJimKeep saying it again and again and it will start to sound right.

It's funny how the rules or the language doesn't always work?
For the same situation, would you say " I cut to much orange (apple) "? If my ear serves me right, we'd say "..too many oranges ". That said, I find myself stumped with onion. What sounds right to your ear ? Or both would work ?

Fivejedjon · Answer

grammarfreakWhat sounds right to your ear ? Or both would work ?

Philip gave excellent advice - if we have inividual (roughly) spherical things, we have countable apples, oranges, onions, tomatoes, etc, and we can have too many or too few of them. Once they are sliced, diced, crushed, boiled into a pulp/mash, etc, they become uncountable apple, orange, onion, tomato, etc, and we can have too much or too little of it.

Incidentally, this is also true of things that are not (roughly) spherical - that was just the first thought that came to my mind. We can have countable and uncountable, parsnip(s), cucumber(s) and many other fruits and vegetables.

CalifJim · Answer

fivejedjonOnce they are sliced, diced, crushed, ...

This reminds me of how Huddleston points out that countability and boundedness are related.

I suppose a linguist would say "If we destroy the boundaries of an object sufficiently, we make it a substance".

But it seems to me that where exactly the line is between the one and the other is a subjective matter of guesswork, there being an infinite number of boundedness states between "tomatoes" and "tomato paste".

CJ

Grammarfreak · Answer

fivejedjonPhilip gave excellent advice - if we have inividual (roughly) spherical things, we have countable apples, oranges, onions, tomatoes, etc, and we can have too many or too few of them. Once they are sliced, diced, crushed, boiled into a pulp/mash, etc, they become uncountable apple, orange, onion, tomato, etc, and we can have too much or too little of it.

Philip's points are 100% valid. What I was referring to is the OP when the person was cutting the veggies and suddenly realized he cut too much / many onion(s) as asked for the recipe. At that point in time, what do you suggest that he should say ? " My gosh! I think I cut too many unions, or I cut too much union. To me, either one fit the contex.

Fivejedjon · Answer

It depends on whether he is thinking of the onions he has sliced or the sliced onion he has produced. In either case, it won't be a conscious choice.

Grammarfreak · Answer

I guess you keep missing my point. From a native speaker's perspective, what would you say at that point in time based on idiomatic or linguistic reflex ?

Fivejedjon · Answer

grammarfreakI guess you keep missing my point.

Apparently so.

grammarfreak. From a native speaker's perspective, what would you say at that point in time based on idiomatic or linguistic reflex ?

Sorry, but I don't understand your question.

Grammarfreak · Answer

fivejedjonSorry, but I don't understand your question.

All right. Never mind.

Grammar question no. 66: tomatoes and cut tomatoes?

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