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Usenet Posted 22 years ago
Usage
Gershwin says "ersters" and I say baloney
While watching "Shall We Dance?" (1937) last
evening, I noticed that the character played by
Fred Astaire (who in turn was played by Frederic
Austerlitz, Jr of Omaha, Nebraska) pronounced
"Denise" with an "s" sound, while his friend,
played by Edward Everett Horton, played by Ed
Horton of Brooklyn, pronounced "Denise" with a
"z" sound. They were talking about the same
person.
Another odd thing was the way the character
played by Ginger Rogers, who was played by
Virginia Katherine McMath of Independence,
Missouri ("Jinja" being a child's pronunciation
of "Virginia"), pronounced "secretive" with
the second syllable stressed. AHD sanctions this
pronunciation, but it sounds like something to
do with secretions rather than secrets.
Also, as terrific as George Gershwin and His
Lovely Wife Ira are as a songwriting team, I
think they really let the side down in "Let's Call the Whole Thing Off." Nobody, and I mean
no-BAHD-y, says "po-TAH-toe" or "ersters", do
they? Certainly nobody in this movie does.
Michael West
Melbourne, Australia
evening, I noticed that the character played by
Fred Astaire (who in turn was played by Frederic
Austerlitz, Jr of Omaha, Nebraska) pronounced
"Denise" with an "s" sound, while his friend,
played by Edward Everett Horton, played by Ed
Horton of Brooklyn, pronounced "Denise" with a
"z" sound. They were talking about the same
person.
Another odd thing was the way the character
played by Ginger Rogers, who was played by
Virginia Katherine McMath of Independence,
Missouri ("Jinja" being a child's pronunciation
of "Virginia"), pronounced "secretive" with
the second syllable stressed. AHD sanctions this
pronunciation, but it sounds like something to
do with secretions rather than secrets.
Also, as terrific as George Gershwin and His
Lovely Wife Ira are as a songwriting team, I
think they really let the side down in "Let's Call the Whole Thing Off." Nobody, and I mean
no-BAHD-y, says "po-TAH-toe" or "ersters", do
they? Certainly nobody in this movie does.
Michael West
Melbourne, Australia
Top answer
[nq:1]Also, as terrific as George Gershwin and His Lovely Wife Ira are as a songwriting team,[/nq] Wife? You jest, I assume...
- [nq:1]Also, as terrific as George Gershwin and His Lovely Wife Ira are as a songwriting team,[/nq] Wife?
- You jest, I assume...
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176 Answers
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[nq:1]Also, as terrific as George Gershwin and His Lovely Wife Ira are as a songwriting team,[/nq]
Wife? You jest, I assume...
Wife? You jest, I assume...
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[nq:2]Also, as terrific as George Gershwin and His Lovely Wife Ira are as a songwriting team,[/nq]
[nq:1]Wife? You jest, I assume...[/nq]
More than just assume, methinks: it's a fairly well-known joke (hence Michael's capitalising).
Cheers, Harvey
Ottawa/Toronto/Edmonton for 30 years;
Southern England for the past 21 years.
(for e-mail, change harvey to whhvs)
[nq:1]Wife? You jest, I assume...[/nq]
More than just assume, methinks: it's a fairly well-known joke (hence Michael's capitalising).
Cheers, Harvey
Ottawa/Toronto/Edmonton for 30 years;
Southern England for the past 21 years.
(for e-mail, change harvey to whhvs)
00
[nq:1]Also, as terrific as George Gershwin and His Lovely Wife Ira are as a songwriting team, I think they really ... Whole Thing Off." Nobody, and I mean no-BAHD-y, says "po-TAH-toe" or "ersters", do they? Certainly nobody in this movie does.[/nq]
I think there were people who said "ersters", or something similar. For one thing, it might approximate a then-still-existing dialectal pron
I think there were people who said "ersters", or something similar. For one thing, it might approximate a then-still-existing dialectal pron
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[nq:2]Also, as terrific as George Gershwin and His Lovely Wife ... or "ersters", do they? Certainly nobody in this movie does.[/nq]
[nq:1]I think there were people who said "ersters", or something similar. For one thing, it might approximate a then-still-existing dialectal ... Baltimore, Md. dialect, or was. Maybe Joe Manfre knows more from that. Don't some Texans say "erl" for "oil", r
[nq:1]I think there were people who said "ersters", or something similar. For one thing, it might approximate a then-still-existing dialectal ... Baltimore, Md. dialect, or was. Maybe Joe Manfre knows more from that. Don't some Texans say "erl" for "oil", r
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[nq:1]Nobody, and I mean no-BAHD-y, says "po-TAH-toe" or "ersters"[/nq]
If somebody wanted to say "noBAHDy" or "poTAHtoe", how should they pronounce them?
If somebody wanted to say "noBAHDy" or "poTAHtoe", how should they pronounce them?
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[nq:2]Also, as terrific as George Gershwin and His Lovely Wife Ira are as a songwriting team,[/nq]
[nq:1]Wife? You jest, I assume...[/nq]
It's a very old musician's gag, and, being
a very old musician, I'm entitled.
Michael West
Melbourne, Australia
[nq:1]Wife? You jest, I assume...[/nq]
It's a very old musician's gag, and, being
a very old musician, I'm entitled.
Michael West
Melbourne, Australia
00
[nq:2]I think there were people who said "ersters", or something ... from that. Don't some Texans say "erl" for "oil", reputedly?[/nq]
[nq:1]The thing to remember in all those oi/er discussions is that it's not a rhotic R.[/nq]
"Ersters" is definitely rhoticized in the Fred and Ginger version.
Michael West
Melbourne, Australia
[nq:1]The thing to remember in all those oi/er discussions is that it's not a rhotic R.[/nq]
"Ersters" is definitely rhoticized in the Fred and Ginger version.
Michael West
Melbourne, Australia
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(in a discussion in which the famous "oi"-"er" relationship was mentioned)
[nq:1]The thing to remember in all those oi/er discussions is that it's not a rhotic R.[/nq]
This (not that) has been said more than once before, but it needs repeating now and then:
The pop linguistics literature reminds us that it's a fallacy to think anyone says "foist" for "first" and "first" for "foi
[nq:1]The thing to remember in all those oi/er discussions is that it's not a rhotic R.[/nq]
This (not that) has been said more than once before, but it needs repeating now and then:
The pop linguistics literature reminds us that it's a fallacy to think anyone says "foist" for "first" and "first" for "foi
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[nq:1]Nobody, and I mean no-BAHD-y, says "po-TAH-toe" or "ersters", do they?[/nq]
My wife says that her mother, born in 1903, who lived her whole life in Brookport, IL with a few years in Cape Girardeau, MO, said "ersters". She could only with some effort make the "oy" sound. Her ancestors came from England circa 1870.
"Ersters" is also a classic New Orleans "yat" pronunciation. See
My wife says that her mother, born in 1903, who lived her whole life in Brookport, IL with a few years in Cape Girardeau, MO, said "ersters". She could only with some effort make the "oy" sound. Her ancestors came from England circa 1870.
"Ersters" is also a classic New Orleans "yat" pronunciation. See
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[nq:2]Nobody, and I mean no-BAHD-y, says "po-TAH-toe" or "ersters"[/nq]
[nq:1]If somebody wanted to say "noBAHDy" or "poTAHtoe", how should they pronounce them?[/nq]
With whatever vowel of their dialect they think is best expressed by "AH", of course. Probably the same one as they have in the word "blah".
-Aaron J. Dinkin
Dr. Whom
[nq:1]If somebody wanted to say "noBAHDy" or "poTAHtoe", how should they pronounce them?[/nq]
With whatever vowel of their dialect they think is best expressed by "AH", of course. Probably the same one as they have in the word "blah".
-Aaron J. Dinkin
Dr. Whom
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