Future perfect?

Question

Which tense is this?Which is correct and most importantly, WHY?I've looked everywhere to find a detailed explanation of the correct usage and it's really bothering me that I cannot come up with any answers. I've asked my English professor and I'll post the response below as well.I would beat you until you died.ORI would beat you until you die.My English professor actually emailed his wife who is the editor of the Journal of American Medical Association and this was her response, "...The one thing that pops into my head is that the tenses would have to match. If you used died, it would have to be 'I will (or would) have beaten you until you died.' "Is there any one who can tell me the specific rule/tense/whatever that would determine why you would use one or the other?

Clive · Accepted Answer

Hi,

Which is correct and most importantly, WHY?

I would beat you until you died.

OR

I would beat you until you die.

Is there any one who can tell me the specific rule/tense/whatever that would determine why you would use one or the other?

It would be helpful to have a little context here, because 'would' can be used in different ways.

eg future in the past

Q: When you were young and you didn't do your homework, what would your father do?

A: He would beat me until I died. (Obvously, an exaggeration!)

Here, the past tense is used. It reflects that this actually happened in the past, he actually beat me and I actually cried.

eg future conditional (which is what I think you are asking about)

Q: I know you always do your homework, but what would your father do if you didn't?

A: He would beat me until I died. (Obvously, either an exaggeration or a harsh father!)

Here , everything is hypothetical or 'unreal'. The past tense reflects this 'unreality'. We see this more clearly in a simpler example of 'unreality' like 'If I won ten million dollars, I would buy a big house'.

This is a tricky question that you are asking. Other people may offer you other comments.

Best wishes, Clive

Anonymous · Answer

Clive wrote:

>Q: I know you always do your homework, but what would your father do if you didn't?
>A: He would beat me until I died.

Yes, "until I died" is used in the subordinate instead of "until I would die" as a result of tense simplification (Swan, Practical English Usage, p. 584).

Wwwdotcom · Answer

Simple present doesn't sound right. You can't die multiple times. We do use "am/are dying" to give the image of ones health deteriorating. For example, "If the cancer patient is dying, and he only has 3 months before he will die, he might as well take this experimental treatment to avoid death." Adding "would" introduces a hypothetical that is not probable. He didn't take the treatment, and he died after 3 months. It is now 5 months later, he could have taken the treatment, and the doctors are all wondering, "If he had taken the treatment, would he have lived / (not live)".

Another approach is to see how the tenses work in different situations:

I WOULD:

1. serve you food until you finish / serve you food until you finished
2. watch TV until you return / watch TV until you returned
3. use an umbrella until the rain stops / use an umbrella until the rain stopped

That is as far as I can go without arguing the need for "were". It seems the sentence "I would ....until you...." is not a complete thought. It would originate from, "If.... were...., I would....until you...."

You have to state the IF condition in order to clarify the subjunctive.

"If you were a monster in my closet, I would beat you until you die/died."

This is like saying, "If you were a monster in my closet, I would beat you until you WERE DEAD."

Which of the two best matches "were dead"? I go with "died".

Future perfect?

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