'f' made with both lips closed

Question

Hello. Is there a such thing as 'f' made with both lips closed? According to this paper, 'p' in 'supper' becomes like 'f', except both lips are closed. It also says 'f' in 'rifts' is pronounced like 'f' with both lips closed, the lower lip playing no role.
What does this mean and how is it different from the usual way of pronouncing 'p'?

Similarly, it says the sound of 'ph' in 'sphere' is made like the sound of 'p' with the bottom lip against the upper teeth. Again, how does this differ from the usual way of pronouncing 'f'?

Thank you

Kooyeen · Accepted Answer

Hi Optimus,

I've never heard of that. As far as I know, the P's in supper are P's and have nothing to do with F's.

a B is a vocalized P (your throat vibrates), a P is a unvocalized B (your throat doesn't vibrate)

a V is a vocalized F (your throat vibrates), a F is a unvocalized V (your throat doesn't vibrate)

But B's and P's are not related to V's and F's. The PH in sphere should be pronounced as F.

I don't know where you read that stuff, maybe it refers to a particular kind of English, something regional, I don't know. I guess there are a lot of regional ways to pronounce both vowels an consonants, and the pronounciation varies from person to person, so maybe what you wrote applies to some native speakers.

Anonymous · Answer

OptimusHello. Is there a such thing as 'f' made with both lips closed?

Not in English.

In English, "f" and "v" are made with the lower lip touching the upper teeth.

Optimus · Answer

Yes, I had never heard of this before. But I don't think the paper is completely spurious.
Here is the direct link:
http://www.orlapubs.com/AL/L10.pdf

This was one of the top results when I searched for 'epenthetic t.' I've read several papers from the site, and they make several valid points such as "change /s/ and /z/ to laminopalatal 's' (/sh/) and 'z' (/zh/), respectively, before palatal (e.g., miss you, tissue)."

Your input will be appreciated.

Thank you

Anonymous · Answer

I don't know what dialect of English this article is talking about, but it's not mine. I don't pronounce /f/ and /v/ as occlusives in any environment. Their "lenition" isn't true for me either - /p/ /b/ /k/ and /g/ are not pronounced as fricatives in my speech, in any environment. It mentions "parts of Ireland" - these variations might be true for Irish English, I don't know.

They do make some sensible points about deletion in consonant clusters though - how /f/ is deleted before "th", and how pairs like "laze" and "lathes" are distinguished by the length of the sibilant.

But where did Bailey get all this data from? He doesn't say.

'f' made with both lips closed

Top answer

Get the Weekly English Kit 📬

Related Questions