Etymology of "Gyp" / "gypped"

Question

Does anyone have the etymology of gyp? From a bit of Googling it seems to be from "gypsy", but I'm not sure. It'd be great (for me) if there was some other equally convincing etymology, but I'm unable to find one.

Thanks for any help.

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[nq:1]Does anyone have the etymology of gyp? From a bit of Googling itseems to be from "gypsy", but I'm not sure. It'd be great (for me) if therewas some other equally convincing etymology, but I'm unable to find one. Thanks for any help.[/nq]
I assume you mean the verb form of "gyp". Around here it means to be cheated and I very much associate it with Gypsies, which abound here in Missouri. I wouldn't normally call a Gypsy a "Gyp", as the dictionary gives for the noun meaning, but this may be a term in other regions. The most common use in this area would be something like, "I got gypped on my last car", meaning that I was cheated or got a bad deal. We also say "I got took", or "screwed".
A similar slang verb, though slightly different in meaning, is "jew". It would be used like, "I got jewed out of it", or "I jewed him down on it". The former implies a swindle while the latter implies shrewd negotiation of a price.
Don
Kansas City

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cf. "welsh"

Andrew Gwilliam
To email me, replace "bottomless pit" with "silverhelm"

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[nq:1]Does anyone have the etymology of gyp? From a bit of Googling it seems to be from "gypsy", but I'm not sure. It'd be great (for me) if there was some other equally convincing etymology, but I'm unable to find one.[/nq]
This is an extract from a couple of recent mailings from Michael Quinion's World Wide Words site:
http://www.worldwidewords.org/maillist/index.htm
8 Jan 2005Q. My father-in-law often referred to something painful as "giving me gyp". This does not seem to correlate to the other meaning of "cheat". Any suggestions? (Joan Wilton, Canada)
A. "Gyp" is a moderately common expression, mainly in the UK, but also in Commonwealth countries, though my gut feeling is that it's now mostly used by older people. It appears in fixed phrases that refer to some part of the body being painful, as in this example from the London Evening Standard in August 2003: "I turned my ankle in the game and it's still giving me gyp."
The other meaning you give has no connection - it's a derogatory term that is usually said to derive from the word "gypsy" (see http://quinion.com/?G91P). The sense of pain seems to be connected with a northern English dialect word, variously spelled "gip" or "jip", that only ever appeared in the form "to give somebody or something jip". It could mean to give a person or an object a sound thrashing (one example is of a man giving a carpet a beating), or generally to treat roughly or to cause pain.
We're not certain where it comes from, but the English Dialect Dictionary gives one sense of the word as "to arouse to greater exertions by means of some sudden, unexpected action". That fits with the suggestion in the Oxford English Dictionary that it's a contracted form of "gee-up", a conventionalised version of the cry one utters to get a horse to move. Presumably the pain sense evolved through the excessive use of that unexpected action in persuading a person or animal to do one's bidding.

12 Feb 2005
GYP You may remember the item in the newsletter of 8 January about "gyp", in the sense of something that causes one pain ("My ankle is giving me gyp"). I said then, correctly, that it was not connected with gypsies, and especially not with the derogatory verb "to gyp", to cheat or defraud, but came from English dialect. However, Chris Colton e-mailed querying "gyppy", as in "gyppy tummy", a term for diarrhoea. This does have the same origin as "gypsy" - a mangled form of "Egyptian".

"Gyppy tummy" is noted by Eric Partridge as World War Two services slang for the ailment suffered by British forces in the North African desert campaign, and it was a phrase that was common in Britain after the War. Having recently returned from Egypt with a case of it, I can attest to its power! It seems certain that "gyppy" was influenced in its creation by the pain sense of "gyp", but also built on "gyppy" or "gippy", a slang term for an Egyptian that can be traced back to Lord Kitchener's army in Egypt in the 1880s and 1890s.

Matti

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[nq:2]A similar slang verb, though slightly different in meaning, is"jew". ... swindle while the latter implies shrewd negotiation of a price.[/nq]
[nq:1]cf. "welsh"[/nq]
We have the term "welsh" (though it is more commonly said "welch" here) that has a slightly different meaning. To "welch" on a bet is to renege on paying monies owed.
Don
Kansas City

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[nq:1]We have the term "welsh" (though it is more commonly said "welch"here) that has a slightly different meaning. To "welch" on a bet is to renege on paying monies owed.[/nq]
That is simply an obsolescent spelling of "Welsh"; for example Robert Graves was in "the Welch Regiment" and, last time I heard, they still used that spelling.

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Father Ignatius had it:

It's spelled that way on the commemorative arch at Ypres - I was worried until I checked that it really was a valid form.

David
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[nq:1]Does anyone have the etymology of gyp? From a bit of Googling itseems to be from "gypsy", but I'm not sure. It'd be great (for me) if therewas some other equally convincing etymology, but I'm unable to find one.[/nq]
The COED says it's "C19: of unknown origina" which suggests that it is not from "gypsy", or this would be known, and would presumably be of much earlier origin.
An alternative meaning of "gyp" is "a college servant at the universities of Cambridge and Durham", and suggests that this might be from "gippo", which means "a menial kitchen servant", this word being derived from the French jupeau , which means "a man's short tunic" (modern French has jupe = "skirt"). This meaning, I guess, would match as closely as the "gypsy" theory to poor, mean, cheating sort of person, who might cause one distress.
In some forms of CommonwelathE, such as ZimE and, I think, AusE and KiwE, "gippo" is used in a related sense of cheating, e.g. "I gippoed a repair on the motorbike", meaning an ad hoc fiddling around that fortunately worked. I suspect that this might suggest a link to earlier Army slang relating to "Gyppo" = "Egyptian", relating to the experience of the various armies of the British Empire in the recent emergency.

I always saw "My back is giving me gip" written with this variant spelling, which the COED merely acknowledges. Maybe it means, "Oh, my aching back, you can't get good help nowadays" .

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Father Ignatius had it:
[nq:2]Does anyone have the etymology of gyp? From a bit ... other equally convincing etymology, but I'm unable to find one.[/nq]
[nq:1]The COED says it's "C19: of unknown origina" which suggests that it is not from "gypsy", or this would be ... to "Gyppo" = "Egyptian", relating to the experience of the various armies of the British Empire in the recent emergency.[/nq]
"gippo" or "gyppo" is one of the UK regional variants (East Midlands) of the term which has recently been generalised as "chav". Here in the North West we have "scally"; "pikey" and "towny" are also known. I had assumed that "gyppo" came from gypsy, but perhaps it goes back further.

David
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replace usenet with the

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[nq:2]We have the term "welsh" (though it is more commonly ... on a bet is to renege on paying monies owed.[/nq]
[nq:1]That is simply an obsolescent spelling of "Welsh"; for example Robert Graves was in "the Welch Regiment" and, last time I heard, they still used that spelling.[/nq]
Except that no-one has demonstrated an etymological connection between "to welsh on a deal" and the Welsh or the Welch.
Matti

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[nq:1]Except that no-one has demonstrated an etymological connection between "to welsh on a deal" and the Welsh or the Welch.[/nq]
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Etymology of "Gyp" / "gypped"

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