Conditional on

Question

a. I booked the room, dependent on that it doesn't sell in the interim.b. I booked the room, depending on that it doesn't sell in the interim.c. I booked the room, but it is dependent on whether it doesn't sell or not in the interim. d. I booked the room, conditional on that it doesnt sell in the interim.e. I booked the room, but it is conditional on that it doesnt sell in the interim. Which are correct?Thanks

Avangi · Accepted Answer

How about, ". . . . , contingent on its not being sold in the interim." ??

In my opinion, only (c) is grammatical. It is also quite awkward (to the native ear.)
We have to ask the difference between "sells or not" and "doesn't sell or not."

(If it doesn't not sell we're out of luck!)

I applaud your perseverance, BTW.

English 1b3 · Answer

Hi, there

Take a look at this. It may alter your opinion a wee bit:

http://www.ldoceonline.com/dictionary/conditional_1

AvangiI applaud your perseverance, BTW

Thanks! It could also be called an unhealthy obsession

Avangi · Answer

your reference:

it will only be done if something else happens first
His agreement to buy our house was conditional on our leaving all the furniture in it.

Leaving something is not much of an action. It's certainly not an event.

If you want to use these examples, you have to admit that the condition is NOT doing something:
not taking the furniture (in your reference)
not selling the room to someone else in the interim (in your example)

What is the alteration you hope to elicit in my opinion?

Depending /dependent on that it doesn't sell is ungrammatical, is it not?

(I'm not finding fault with your conditional.)

English 1b3 · Answer

Avangi
Leaving something is not much of an action. It's certainly not an event.

Are you just pointing out the examples are different? I'm not sure what point you are making here, sorry.

Avangi
Depending /dependent on that it doesn't sell is ungrammatical, is it not?

Definitely. I was told 'conditional on that it doesn't sell' was grammatical, but it sounded wrong to me.

Avangi · Answer

English 1b3 Take a look at this. It may alter your opinion a wee bit:

Hmmm - Timing is everything!
I was trying to find out what you objected to in my previous.
You gave six versions of your room reservation. I rejected all but one, and even that one seemed to be tied up with a double negative. (It correctly led to a positive, but was almost unreadable.)
I thought the above captioned was in refutation of my criticism, but I couldn't really see how the internet reference justified any of the sentences I objected to.

Maybe "conditional on that it doesn't sell" is grammatical, but I don't hear it as idiomatic.
I understand that you're deeply into "that" clauses, but I don't think you can replace every noun in Christendom with a "that" clause.

I believe "conditional on its not selling" is both grammatical and idiomatic.

English 1b3 · Answer

Hi again, Avangi

Just thought I'd mention that the sentence came from a friend (who I wouldn't exactly claim to be a grammar expert), so he could very well have written the sentence incorrectly. I thought it read wrongly, but a 'teacher' on a different forum (who is a non-native, however) said the sentence was fine. But I agree; it doesn't sound right to me either!

I searched google books for "conditional on that." The searches on the first page (I didn't bother looking further) didn't show any results for a noun clause following 'conditional on,' instead showing 'that' as a determiner or pronoun.

Logic tells me that it is possible, however. Here is why:

Avangi I believe "conditional on its not selling" is both grammatical and idiomatic.

Following 'on' is a gerund 'selling' (plus a possessive pronoun and adverb), which functions as a noun. A noun clause functions as a noun also. SO, I can't see why it wouldn't work. Maybe it is just unidiomatic, as you say.

What do you think?

Avangi · Answer

Many students without the dubious benefit of a native ear submit examples which are judged to be grammatical but not idiomatic.
In my case, the ear is primary. I have to struggle to defend in grammatical terms what my ear is telling me, and sometimes succeed only in making an *** of myself. So I can sympathize with those who are coming at it from the other direction.
Everyone accepts that prepositions are impossible to pin down with rules of thumb. Verbs are much more cooperative. But still, you often can't find a good reason why one verb works differently than another. Some people group them and catalog them and make up names for their different behaviours. It seems like a lot of work, but many students are able to benefit from the work these people do. I think it takes discipline, which you certainly have.

Conditional on

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