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Usenet Posted 22 years ago
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Chinese Menus
In New York it is normal for Chinese menus to have (traditional) character names listed. That works fine for me, but I have noticed in other places and increasingly even in areas of NYC without concentrations of Chinese or Vietnamese that menus are listing only "Romanized" names. These names don't seem to correspond with any of Pinyin, Wade-Giles, Guoyeu Romatzyh, Yale, or Zhuyin Fuhao. Where do these romanized names come from? Are they, perhaps, Southern in origin and outside the lexicon to which I have normal access? Take a simple and ubiquitous example: "Lo mein." This seems to get every vowel wrong according to either my Mandarin or Cantonese texts. What gives?
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[nq:1]In New York it is normal for Chinese menus to have (traditional) character names listed. That works fine for me, ... " This seems to get every vowel wrong according to either my Mandarin or Cantonese texts.
- [nq:1]In New York it is normal for Chinese menus to have (traditional) character names listed.
- That works fine for me, ...
- " This seems to get every vowel wrong according to either my Mandarin or Cantonese texts.
- [/nq] MWCD11 suggests that "lo mein" and various other names for Sino-American dishes come from Cantonese, aka Guangdong: chop suey Etymology: Chinese (Guangdong) odds and ends, from miscellaneous + bits Date: 1888 chow mein Etymology: Chinese (Guangdong) fried noodles Date: 1898 egg foo yong Etymology: Chinese (Guangdong) egg white, egg-coated ingredients, literally, a kind of hibiscus Date: 1917 lo mein Etymology: Chinese (Guangdong) stirred noodles Date: 1970 I assume the restaurateurs who established these spellings in American Chinatowns cared not a whit for Wade-Giles et al.
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92 Answers
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[nq:1]In New York it is normal for Chinese menus to have (traditional) character names listed. That works fine for me, ... example: "Lo mein." This seems to get every vowel wrong according to either my Mandarin or Cantonese texts. What gives?[/nq]
MWCD11 suggests that "lo mein" and various other names for Sino-American dishes come from Cantonese, aka Guangdong:
chop suey
Etymology: Chi
MWCD11 suggests that "lo mein" and various other names for Sino-American dishes come from Cantonese, aka Guangdong:
chop suey
Etymology: Chi
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Martin Ambuhl wrote on 08 Oct 2004:
[nq:1]In New York it is normal for Chinese menus to have (traditional) character names listed. That works fine for me, ... example: "Lo mein." This seems to get every vowel wrong according to either my Mandarin or Cantonese texts. What gives?[/nq]
Looks like English phonetics to me. Here in Taiwan, people spell "mein" as "mien" and pronounce it as (mEn)
[nq:1]In New York it is normal for Chinese menus to have (traditional) character names listed. That works fine for me, ... example: "Lo mein." This seems to get every vowel wrong according to either my Mandarin or Cantonese texts. What gives?[/nq]
Looks like English phonetics to me. Here in Taiwan, people spell "mein" as "mien" and pronounce it as (mEn)
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[nq:1]I assume the restaurateurs who established these spellings in American Chinatowns cared not a whit for Wade-Giles et al.[/nq]
I had heard that most Americanizations originated in San Francisco via the Chinese railroad workers.
I had heard that most Americanizations originated in San Francisco via the Chinese railroad workers.
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[nq:1]In New York it is normal for Chinese menus to have (traditional) character names listed. That works fine for me, ... example: "Lo mein." This seems to get every vowel wrong according to either my Mandarin or Cantonese texts. What gives?[/nq]
Here it varies from restaurant to restaurant.
But some Romanisations seem to be fairly comon, and look to my (very untutored) eye more like Wade
Here it varies from restaurant to restaurant.
But some Romanisations seem to be fairly comon, and look to my (very untutored) eye more like Wade
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[nq:1]Here it varies from restaurant to restaurant. But some Romanisations seem to be fairly comon, and look to my (very untutored) eye more like Wade Giles than Pinyin. Common ones: chow fan (or farn)(snip)[/nq]
In the US this sometimes appears as "chow fon". Paul Simon sang of eating "some Lin's chow fon" in his 1970 song "Paranoia Blues", referring to a restaurant in New York's Chinatown ca
In the US this sometimes appears as "chow fon". Paul Simon sang of eating "some Lin's chow fon" in his 1970 song "Paranoia Blues", referring to a restaurant in New York's Chinatown ca
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[nq:1]In New York it is normal for Chinese menus to have (traditional) character names listed. That works fine for me, ... example: "Lo mein." This seems to get every vowel wrong according to either my Mandarin or Cantonese texts. What gives?[/nq]
I doubt if any particular system was used, I think Chinese restaurateurs just transliterate any way they see fit. Some names, like lo mein and chow
I doubt if any particular system was used, I think Chinese restaurateurs just transliterate any way they see fit. Some names, like lo mein and chow
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[nq:2]In New York it is normal for Chinese menus to ... according to either my Mandarin or Cantonese texts. What gives?[/nq]
[nq:1]Here it varies from restaurant to restaurant. But some Romanisations seem to be fairly comon, and look to my (very ... ones: chow fan (or farn) chop suey foo yong (or young) But "sweet & sour pork" is invariably Anglicised thus.[/nq]
For some reason, they usual
[nq:1]Here it varies from restaurant to restaurant. But some Romanisations seem to be fairly comon, and look to my (very ... ones: chow fan (or farn) chop suey foo yong (or young) But "sweet & sour pork" is invariably Anglicised thus.[/nq]
For some reason, they usual
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What the heck does a Chinese waiter mean when he says "Chinese tea"? Have the Chinese somehow got the idea that us round-eyes never drink anything but black tea, and only Chinese appreciate the rest of the semi-fermented and green teas?
Whenever I ask for tea in a dim sum place, I expect green tea. In my favorite places a pot of green tea was as much part of the ambiance as multilayered white-
Whenever I ask for tea in a dim sum place, I expect green tea. In my favorite places a pot of green tea was as much part of the ambiance as multilayered white-
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John Ings wrote on 08 Oct 2004:
[nq:1]What the heck does a Chinese waiter mean when he says "Chinese tea"? Have the Chinese somehow got the idea ... blank and inquires "Chinese tea?" To add to the confusion sometimes what's delivered is an Oolong or other semi-fermented tea.[/nq]
Hot Chinese tea is almost always drunk without sugar or milk. In Chinese restaurants, it's usually jasmine tea
[nq:1]What the heck does a Chinese waiter mean when he says "Chinese tea"? Have the Chinese somehow got the idea ... blank and inquires "Chinese tea?" To add to the confusion sometimes what's delivered is an Oolong or other semi-fermented tea.[/nq]
Hot Chinese tea is almost always drunk without sugar or milk. In Chinese restaurants, it's usually jasmine tea
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On 8 Oct 2004 13:21:39 GMT, CyberCypher
[nq:1]Black tea is Indian tea, Ceylon tea, and English breakfast tea.[/nq]
Oh foo! And other expressions of disagreement!
One important component of the best English
breakfast tea is a choice Keemun!
And China has always had excellent black teas.
[nq:1]Black tea is Indian tea, Ceylon tea, and English breakfast tea.[/nq]
Oh foo! And other expressions of disagreement!
One important component of the best English
breakfast tea is a choice Keemun!
And China has always had excellent black teas.
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