Before I do/did, I would ask you

Question

Please help me....!#1. Before I handed in the paper, I would ask him to check it.#2. Before I hand in the paper, I would ask him to check it.Would you kindly explain to me the difference between the two...?

Philip · Accepted Answer

FeathersPlease help me....!

#1. Before I handed in the paper, I would ask him to check it.

#2. Before I hand in the paper, I would ask him to check it.

Would you kindly explain to me the difference between the two...?

1. "would" here is a substitute for "used to", indicating habitual action in the past.

2. "would" here is incorrect: it should be "will", indicating a future action.

2a. Leave out "will", and you are indicating normal current actions.

Feathers · Answer

Thank you, Philip, for your help. The sentence 2 is incorrect...? It sounds too strong to me...
Couldn't we say that this 'would' adds some nuance of hesitation(?) to the sentence?

I guessed the sentence #1 has to be interpreted as habitual, whereas #2 is not. Then I started to wonder whether the sentence #2 could be interpreted as habitual or not. (If not, why on earth...?)

CalifJim · Answer

No, the first sentence need not be interpreted as habitual. Another interpretation is that it is conditional. As such it is a very near equivalent to the sentence below.

If I were you, I would ask him to check the paper before I handed it in.

The second sentence is not typical in modern English, though I can just barely accept it as much older English -- English at a time when would was more frequently used as a tentative or humble expression of want or wish. You would need to read a good bit of Shakespeare to get the feel of this usage.

Before I hand in the paper, I [would / would like to / wish to] ask him to check it.

Compare:

There have been many accidents on that highway, so I [would / would like to / wish to] ask you to be especially careful when traveling on it. (Similar to: ... so please be careful when ... but more formal.)

This usage is restricted almost exclusively to I/We would ask you to ... in modern English, and it is not often used even there. (Someone will do the required Googling and report the results if I'm wrong about this, I'm sure!) It is in the same category as beseech, perhaps, (I beseech you to be careful.) by which I mean that it is practically never used.

The use of will instead of would in that sentence, as described by Philip, would be the first choice of English speakers today.

CJ

Feathers · Answer

Hello CJ, and thank you so much. You are amazing!!

This question bothered me for some time because I couldn't understand the following lines from Robert Frost:

Before I built a wall I'd ask to know
What I was walling in or walling out,
And to whom I was like to give offence.

(Mending Wall)

Conditional! There's implicit "if I were you"...!

(Yes, neither "past habitual" interpretation nor "I'd have asked.." paraphrasing wouldn't do in the context, I felt that. It was hard somewhat to imagine Robert Frost saying, decisively, "I used to ask myself to whom I was like to give offence before I built a wall." )

As to the second sentence, I need to think it over.

Thank you CJ, for helping me.

Marius Hancu · Answer

CalifJim This usage is restricted almost exclusively to I/We would ask you to ... in modern English, and it is not often used even there.

I find enough samples at The New York times with:
I would ask him to:

http://select.nytimes.com/gst/abstract.html?res=F60D17F935580C708DDDAC0894DC404482

... honesty, so I would ask him to consider that America's ...

http://select.nytimes.com/gst/abstract.html?res=F30715F73F5E0C728DDDAB0994DA404482

... a murderer. I would ask him to give me another chance ...

I have no probs with #2, but I agree with your interpretation for #1.

CalifJim · Answer

Did you get equal frequency on I would ask you?
I'm curious.
CJ

Marius Hancu · Answer

CalifJimDid you get equal frequency on I would ask you?
I'm curious.
CJ

Comparable:

"I would ask him to" 19 Results
"I would like to ask him to" 0 Results
"I'd like to ask him to" 2 Results

"I would ask her to" 6 Results

"I would ask them to" 16 Results

"I would ask you to" 25 Results
"I would like to ask you to" 6 Results
"I'd like to ask you to" 7 Results

Marius Hancu · Answer

This is another example similar to #2, from a poets' blog:
-------
I would probably resign because it is not in my nature to sit in a cabinet. But before doing so, I would probably suggest that he calm down, use longer breaths in his lines and not use so many exclamation points!

http://poets9for9.blogspot.com
---------
which is similar to my preferred version for #2:
#2. Before handing in the paper, I would ask him to check it.

CalifJim · Answer

The inclusion of like changes everything.
The comparison should be between I would ask him/her/them vs. I would ask you if you want evidence that second person is used more or less or about the same as third person in that structure.

CJ

Marius Hancu · Answer

CalifJimThe inclusion of like changes everything.
The comparison should be between I would ask him/her/them vs. I would ask you if you want evidence that second person is used more or less or about the same as third person in that structure.

I updated the stats in the above.

Before I do/did, I would ask you

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