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Hi. I have some questions about articles.

1. There's an exercise. You have a picture and in this picture there are a few desks, a few chairs, one book, one bag, one blackboard (on the blackboard there is one big pen, it's sketched), there is one door and one window.

In this exercise you're supposed to ask: What's this? And answer: It's a desk etc. In the answer key all the answers use the article "a". What about "one book", "one door", "one window", "one bag" "one blackboard". The answer key says: "What's this?" "It's a bag". "What's this?" "It's a door". etc.

Shouldn't it rather be "It's the bag", "It's the door" "It's the window (instead of: It's a window)?

2. There is another exercise. Similar to the one above. There's a picture. In the picture there are: one teacher, one board, one door, some boys, some girls, two pencils, two pens, two books, two rubbers, a few desks, two bags, two windows.

Answers from the key: the teacher, the board, a window, the door, a girl, a bag, a boy, a chair, a desk, a book, a pencil, a rubber, a pen.

--- I understand that they used "the" because there was only one teacher, door and board, and more than one girls, pencils, books, bags, etc.

However it seems to be contradictory to exercise number one because there's also "one window" and "one door" etc. and the key says "It's a door" and "It' a window" instead of "It's the door" and "It's the window".

Clive · Accepted Answer

Hi,

1. There's an exercise. You have a picture and in this picture there are a few desks, a few chairs, one book, one bag, one blackboard (on the blackboard there is one big pen, it's sketched), there is one door and one window.

In this exercise you're supposed to ask: What's this? And answer: It's a desk etc. In the answer key all the answers use the article "a". What about "one book", "one door", "one window", "one bag" "one blackboard". Only say 'one' if you want to stress that it's not two, not three, etc. In this case, you don't need to stress that there is just one because everyone can see that it is just one.

The answer key says: "What's this?" "It's a bag". "What's this?" "It's a door". etc.

Shouldn't it rather be "It's the bag", "It's the door" "It's the window (instead of: It's a window)?

This is trickier for me to explain. Let me offer this idea for you to consider. If you say 'It's the bag', it sounds like you want to stress that it's not the door.

eg I point to he bag and say 'Is this the door?'

You answer 'No, it's the bag'.

2. There is another exercise. Similar to the one above. There's a picture. In the picture there are: one teacher, one board, one door, some boys, some girls, two pencils, two pens, two books, two rubbers, a few desks, two bags, two windows.

Answers from the key: the teacher, the board, a window, the door, a girl, a bag, a boy, a chair, a desk, a book, a pencil, a rubber, a pen.

--- I understand that they used "the" because there was only one teacher, door and board, and more than one girls, pencils, books, bags, etc. Yes, that's not a bad explanation. eg in a classroom, we expect there to be a teacher, and only one teacher.

However it seems to be contradictory to exercise number one because there's also "one window" and "one door" etc. and the key says "It's a door" and "It' a window" instead of "It's the door" and "It's the window". It's because we do not have an expectation that a classroom will only have one window.

As I said, these are comments for you to consider. Proper use of articles is hard to learn, and also hard to teach. It takes time. Be patient with yourself.

Clive

Ferdis · Answer

Don't pay any attention to that exercise: it doesn't make sense. Whether to use 'a' or 'the' has nothing to do with how many items there are.

Newguest · Answer

Clive

However it seems to be contradictory to exercise number one because there's also "one window" and "one door" etc. and the key says "It's a door" and "It' a window" instead of "It's the door" and "It's the window". It's because we do not have an expectation that a classroom will only have one window.

And we also don't expect that a classroom will only have one pair of door

?

Clive · Answer

Hi,

Sometimes it's debatable what we can reasonably expect in a situation.

In a classroom -

I strongly expect one teacher.

I don't strongly expect just one window.

I expect one door, but not very, very strongly.

Clive

Newguest · Answer

Clive Hi,

Sometimes it's debatable what we can reasonably expect in a situation.

In a clasroom -

I strongly expect one teacher.

I don't strongly expect just one window.

I expect one door, but not very, very strongly.

Clive

Clive

It's clearer now. Thanks Clive!

CalifJim · Answer

NewguestShouldn't it rather be "It's the bag", "It's the door" "It's the window (instead of: It's a window)?

Not necessarily. It doesn't have to be either "a" or "the". It can be either.

However, the question "What's this?" typically means "What is this an example of?" or "What class of things does this belong to?" Moving to the answer side, "It's a bag" typically means "It is an example of a bag" or "It belongs to the class 'bags' ". So the exercise is looking for typical answers to typical questions.

After establishing what sort of thing it is (with "a"), you may wish to ask further questions about it (with "the").

-- What's this?
-- It's a bag. [This establishes a common focus on that bag. Now both speaker and listener know that it is something in the class 'bags' that they are talking about, and which bag they are talking about. They have agreed that 'bag' will be the word they will use to refer to that object.]

-- What color is the bag? [Now neither speaker nor listener can be in doubt about which bag is meant, so "the" is used.]

-- The bag is red.
-- What is in the bag? [Now watch how the same pattern works with "coin".]

-- A coin.
-- Can you please take the coin out of the bag?

CJ

CalifJim · Answer

Newguest2. There is another exercise. Similar to the one above. There's a picture. ...

Answers from the key: the teacher, the board,

What's the question? You gave answers, but no question.

If the exercise expects you to know at the start that "This is a teacher; this is a window; this is a door"; and so on, then the first stage of identifying the objects is considered finished, and you can now use "the" as you continue into the second stage of talking about the objects you have already identified.

NewguestI understand that they used "the" because there was only one teacher

No. That's pure coincidence. Even if there's only one of something, you can still use either "a" or "the".

CJ

Clive · Answer

Hi CJ,

I hesitate about the word 'coincidence'. There's some degree of reasoning behind the choice of an article.

If you show most people a picture of a classroom with a class in progress, point to one of several students, and ask 'Who is this?', the likely answer will be 'That's a student'.

Bt if you do that while pointing to the figure in front at the blackboard, in my opinion you are more likely to hear 'That's the teacher' than 'That's a teacher'.

Best wishes, Clive

CalifJim · Answer

Hi, Clive,

CliveIf you show most people a picture of a classroom ... the likely answer will be 'That's a student'.

... if you do that while pointing to the figure in front ... you are more likely to hear 'That's the teacher' ...

I agree that those responses are more likely. However, I'm claiming that the choices we make between "the" and "a" are not based on likelihood. We may, in fact, hear "That's a teacher" in the situation you describe, and that would be grammatically correct too, although considerations of likelihood don't explain why.

CliveI hesitate about the word 'coincidence'. There's some degree of reasoning behind the choice of an article.

There may be a misunderstanding, and I'd like to clear it up if I can -- and it won't be easy! I don't think I said anything that implied that there is no reasoning involved in choosing an article -- just that Newguest's reasoning was faulty. The flaw, as I see it, is a very subtle one, and, unfortunately, that will require a fairly lengthy explanation.

______________

In the context of choosing "a" or "the", Newguest said, "I understand that they used "the" [instead of "a"] because there was only one teacher."

I hope I'm not taking that statement too literally when I say that to me this claims that whenever there is one of something, we must use "the", not "a". (I think Newguest's comment about the contradiction between the two exercises supports me in this.) It well may be that in the case at hand there was one teacher and that "the" was used (That's the coincidence), but "the" was not used (in preference over "a") because there was one teacher. One teacher can as easily be "a teacher" as "the teacher". Nothing about the singularity of the noun demands it be preceded by "the", not "a".

My comment about the coincidence was to dissuade Newguest against believing that singularity demands "the". You may need or want to use "the" in a given situation, and there may be some reason for it, but you can't appeal to singularity as the reason, because plurals take "the" equally well.

I don't see it as a matter of using the (as a general principle) when there is only one of a thing. It's that you can pick out a specific object in the environment using the and only the if there is only one of them there. So it's not that "they did use (or had to use) the (and not a) because there was only one", but that they could use the and only the (to create a unique reference) because there was only one. If there were more than one, the alone could not pick out the intended referent; more description would be needed, for example, the teacher wearing the blue skirt or the teacher on the left. Nevertheless, the could still be used for each of two or more teachers.

As it turns out, 'they' could and did choose "the" instead of "a". As I understand the description given of the exercise, the picture can be said to contain "a teacher" as well as to contain "the teacher". It just depends on how the speaker conceptualizes what he's looking at. The reason for choosing the, I claim, has to do with the speaker's wish to create a reference to that particular teacher in the picture (the teacher), and (therefore) his wish not simply to mention a generic member of the class 'teachers' (a teacher).

In any case, it seems to me, in view of what I claim is the reason for such choices, that exercises like the one Newguest has cited are often mostly guessing games, and what the student has to guess is how the exercise-maker conceptualized the elements of the picture. The only thing that can save it is a clear understanding of the point of view the student is to take when answering the questions, and if the instructions for the exercise do not spell that out in great enough detail, the teacher may have to supply what is missing.

Whew! Well, maybe that helped explain my point of view, and maybe it didn't. I'll just have to take my chances!

CJ

Clive · Answer

Well, at any rate, Newguest is getting value for his/her money from us.

Clive

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