a genitive of classification?

Question

Hi,I think I have asked a question or two concerning this area of grammar in the past but this time, I believe I am asking a question from a different angle. Please help.Would you say the underlined part is a genitive of classification? Then would you say, in normal situations, people would go about using 'tigers' den' without the article? It was thrown into a tigers' den.versus --  It was thrown into tigers' den.Also, why would a person resort to using any one of these? My daughter goes to a girl's school.My daughter goes to a girls' school.

CalifJim · Accepted Answer

I don't believe that the term "genitive of classification" is widely used. I'm not familiar with the concept.

<< in normal situations, people would go about using 'tigers' den' without the article? >> No. The article is used.

<< My daughter goes to a girl's school. A school consisting of only one girl is not likely.

My daughter goes to a girls' school. This one is possible. A school for girls. It seems to me that this version without the apostrophe is also common. You might wait for a second opinion on this.>>

CJ

Yoong Liat · Answer

CalifJim
My daughter goes to a girls' school. This one is possible. A school for girls. It seems to me that this version without the apostrophe is also common. You might wait for a second opinion on this. >>
CJ
Hi CJ
You're right. I've made a search. Girls School is also used, but it is not common. The term with the apostrophe is more commonly used.
Oxford University Gazette, 22 October 1998: Colleges
NATASHA GRIGORIAN, formerly of Wallington High School for Girls ... SABRINA WEYENETH, formerly of St Paul's Girls School, London ...

Believer · Answer

Thank you, CalfJim.

You wrote:

My daughter goes to a girls' school. This one is possible. A school for girls. It seems to me that this version without the apostrophe is also common. You might wait for a second opinion on this.>>

In regard to my initial question of whether an article is used in "lions' den" in normal situations, I believe your response was that it is used. Would you say, then, it is similar, if not alike, to the one I quoted above? "a girls' school" means "a school for girls" and "a lions' den" denotes "a den for lions" (or something similar to that ...)

Let us assume plumbers hold their annual conference in a big city. I think the distinction can be made between "a plumbers' conference" and "a plumbers conference" based on whether you are focusing on their possession of the conference or their membership part of the conference. I am writing this but I do not know how to apply this in real world.

Possible name for a center to help local runaway children in the Nowhere city? Nowhere Runaway Children Help Center?? Why not? Nowhere Runaway Children's Help Center

Possible name for a center to help local battered women in the Nowhere city? Nowhere Battered Women Help Center?? Why not? Nowhere Battered Women's Help Center.

Would you say the first choices are better because they are focusing on the group (membership) part of the conference? My big question is "How would you know whether a name is focusing on its membership or its possession of the entity?" I think that will help me put the apostrophe in the right place. It seems to be clear that women and children don't own the centers for the examples above.

Anonymous · Answer

I believe that the response provided to you is incorrect. A "girls school" and a "girls' school" is not the same. In the first instance, "girls" is used as an adjective to describe that the school only has female students; in the second, it is a possessive use of an apostrophe. The second would be used maybe in such an example as follows:

Woman 1: I just started my new job. I'm working at that new school downtown.
Woman 2: Oh really, that is my girls' school! (implying, that's is where my girls attend school).

Adjectival plurals take an "s" only to clarify syntax.

Goodman · Answer

Woman 1: I just started my new job. I'm working at that new school downtown.
Woman 2: Oh really, that is my girls' school! (implying, that's is where my girls attend school).
In spoken speech, listeners may not be able to tell how many girls you are referrring to in that is my girls' school! To avoid confusion, I would say "this the school my girls go to..."

And I will only agree in written form if you have 2 (or more) daughters going to that school. But I don't see it that way If you only have one daughter.

a genitive of classification?

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